Points for stretched tyres..

[kangman]

This is a stretched tyre..

[mani]

[Kos]

Brian, can answer this ??

The MOT test only covers a very limited number of points, and is more concerned with the deterioration of standard parts fitted to the vehicle, rather than illegal modifications that have been deliberately made.

What is illegal about stretch's ?

As I said its down to whats the tester and police think is un safe or an incorrectly mounted tyre. It's a personal opinion, not law.

If I get a letter from Toyo saint their T1r tyre in 195 45 15 size is fine to be mounted on a 9j rim then it simply is and theres nothing to persue until it a law is passed with guidlines.

In regards to this

The sidewalls are clearly operating outside of their intended parameters, having an adverse effect on the performance of the tyre, so i certainly think these "deserve points". I'm fairly sure VOSA and most traffic cops would agree with me.

Are they? Have you checked with the tyre manufacturer

The plain simple fact is the are no clear grounds for issuing points



My "stretch" which you'd say according to your opinion are out side the safe parameters. The tyres didnt pop off the rims during a track day
But they are with in the working parameters according to Falken

Verde, what size tyre width as profile and J of the rim?

Im running 9js allround with 215/40R16s

its really not a huge stretch atal, its a little bit of an angle but...its nothing insane

One chart I've looked at says that tyres of this width (not specifically your make of tyres) are OK up to 8.5" rims, but another says a max. of 8".
9" is only 0.25" over the 8.5" each side, so you might just get away with that, if they accept the 8.5" limit rather than the 8" one, but ultimately my opinion is irrelevant - it's the one the traffic cop adopts that matters.

but is it illegal ? does such a modification legally mean a CU30 ?

no & no

i'll say that anyone putting a 205 on a 9J is asking for trouble but the 215 40 on the 9J is fine. while it may draw attention there's nothing illegal about it. that's the facts that's all matters here.

a CU30 is for defective tyres, they can use a number of offence codes to use that endorsement

TYRE - UNSUITABLE TYPE 112
TYRE - OVER/UNDER INFLATED 113
TYRE - CUT IN FABRIC 114
TYRE - LUMP BULGE OR TEAR 115
TYRE - PLY OR CORD EXPOSED 116
TYRE - TREAD LESS 1.6MM 117
TYRE - TREAD LESS THAN PRESCRIBED 117
TYRE - GROOVES NOT VISIBLE 118
TYRE - TREAD LESS 1MM 118
TYRE - TREAD NOT VISIBLE 118
TYRE - DIFFERENT STRUCTURE ON SAME AXLES 119
TYRE - DIFFERENT TYPES ON DIFFERENT AXLES 120


they will try to use offence code 112 "unsuitable type" but thats more so for the following examples

a. side car tyres or car tyres on a solo machine (note side car outfits may be fitted with 'solo' type tyres on any wheel);

b. Motocross or similar tyres, i.e. tyres where the space between tread blocks is substantially greater than the size of the blocks themselves; which do not have MST (multi service tyre) with an 'E' in a circle or an e in a rectangle moulded into or on to the tyre wall

c. tyres designated by their manufacture as unsuitable for road use e.g. racing tyres or those marked NHS or NOT FOR HIGHWAY USE on the sidewall.

d. a tyre specifically designed for front wheel use fitted to the rear wheel;

e. a bias belted tyre fitted to the front with a cross-ply tyre fitted to the rear wheel or a radial tyre fitted to the front and a cross ply or bias belted tyre fitted to the rear wheel


there is something in the legislation/law which goes like this

"tyres must be suitable (of the correct type and size) for the use to which the vehicle is being put, and must be inflated to the vehicle or tyre manufacturers' recommended pressures

this is another angle the police will try and issue points for. i'll look into it a bit more tomorrow

[verde]

Excellent kos, good researching. Chances are if you mention you know the laws and explain the copper probably wont know himself and will leave it.

[HairyScreech]

Its the catch all in the construction and use regs section 11 that will do you. Unsuitable for the use the vehicle is being put to. Its a pure opinion call.
Also the exposed rim can be considered to have the potential to cause injury or to have the potential to damage the road. Neither of which would be defendable in court as it would be all based on opinion and you would have a hard time defending an exposed rim edge caused by deliberately fitting a type you knew was under sized.
Even if that slides then if the stretch is outside of the testing done for the E marking then the Tyre is no longer suitable for road use as it hasn't based the required testing in that combination so falls foul of part c there.
All this i posted a page previous.

If the officer on the scene wasn't sure its very unlikely they would leave it, they don't take kindly to tyre issues, they also seem to take being told there job by people they have just pulled over in a defective vehicle VERY badly.
Most likely they would call up traffic who would then slap a prohibition notice on the car or tow it and pick it apart for anything they could use to fuck you.

Besides there is no benefit to a stretched type in a performance application. The drift cocks were doing it to make a budget high profile type have reasonable characteristics when forced at an angle that make them want to tuck under or roll off the rim, stretching will simply make the tyre behave as a lower profile at the detriment of control at the limit of adhesion, a correctly sized tyre with a performance design or reinforced sidewalls will both provide more grip and exhibit less sudden loss of traction at the limit.
Stretching a tyre is nothing new, it has been tried since the 1930s in road racing and always quickly abandoned for good reason.

[HairyScreech]

As for why a lot of people look down on the vw scene its because of crap like this.


Too many wannbe heroes with cash and no fucking clue in the vw world, the quality of facepalm material is only beaten by the stance cocks.

We get loads of them at the uni, had one in our class last year, kneck beard wearing twat who's idea of art was instagram photos and possibly the worst mechanic i have ever seen.
The few good vw guys i have met now all either drive bmws or Jap stuff after getting fed up with the hipsters vw now attracts.

[verde]

If u read that whole article ud understand he was doing that for a joke

[pacerpete]

If u read that whole article ud understand he was doing that for a joke

He is obviously bored, maybe he should get a job instead of sitting around smoking weed all day while thinking of ways to get people to look at him, tw4t

[verde]

I do agree. Its a ridiculous joke and hes got too much time and £££. Probably used a ghetto method like someone else posted of a caddy they saw

[suchy]

I read this article when it came out originally. He was only going round the block when he got tugged. He used big nuts wedged in to camber it out.
Still pointless...

[verde]

Yeah someone on here posted a caddy they saw doing that in a halfords carpark

[Speedtouch]

Aye, 'twas me:




The prevalence of rednecks/inbreds in the county ensure that plenty of such pitiful sights are frequently seen.

In fact, only last week, I saw plod stop some young long-haired ejit in his preposterously lowered Mk2 Golf sh*tter, and had him in the back of the patrol car for a good stiff seeing to!

[pacerpete]

Nothing like a good stiff seeing to !

[Andyboy]

I would happily have been part of that " dub scum " in a mk1 jetta if i could have found a decent example

Why does that not surprise me?

Probably because iv stated it many many, many times aswell as my love for the volkswagen scene? Thats probably why.

Nope, more to do with you being a bored ex weed smoker. Just the kind of slouch beanie wearing VW scenester one always imagines behind the wheel of such a vehicle.

No Worries, as they say!

[verde]

Why does that not surprise me?

Probably because iv stated it many many, many times aswell as my love for the volkswagen scene? Thats probably why.

Nope, more to do with you being a bored ex weed smoker. Just the kind of slouch beanie wearing VW scenester one always imagines behind the wheel of such a vehicle.

No Worries, as they say!

haha yeah i know the type, I smoked like, once a month perhaps haha, if that. But anyway all is not lost, i got an e30 before i fell to the dark side

[scjimbo]

Kos/Verde

I have been able to quickly speak to a friend who is in the force. I will speak to him later for you both when he's not busy to get full clarification.

There are a couple of points to note here really.

Kos you are absolutely right that the officer will try and apply offence code 112 under the 1988 RTA. This means you will get 3 points per tyre. However always remember that with points of law in Traffic, that it is at the officers digression within the law. Police forces spend a lot of time/Money keeping these guys up to date on case and points of law to ensure fairness is applied across the board. A Police officer must try to do his job (i.e. issuing tickets) Within the framework of the act of law he is using.

If you believe that the officer has made a mistake obviously you can contest it and have your day in court. In this case for the tyres, the officer has points he needs to prove:

TYRE - UNSUITABLE TYPE 112
TYRE - OVER/UNDER INFLATED 113
TYRE - CUT IN FABRIC 114
TYRE - LUMP BULGE OR TEAR 115
TYRE - PLY OR CORD EXPOSED 116
TYRE - TREAD LESS 1.6MM 117
TYRE - TREAD LESS THAN PRESCRIBED 117
TYRE - GROOVES NOT VISIBLE 118
TYRE - TREAD LESS 1MM 118
TYRE - TREAD NOT VISIBLE 118
TYRE - DIFFERENT STRUCTURE ON SAME AXLES 119
TYRE - DIFFERENT TYPES ON DIFFERENT AXLES 120

It is then your solicitors or your responsibility to present your defences. This could be something like "i only hit the pothole when pulling in for the officer" sec115 or "My motorcycle is less than 50cc" for section 118. Your defence in this situation would have to be that the tyre is suitable for use.

So now for the crunch point. Magistrates are very unlikely to know anything about tyres. If you were to fight hard enough the crown would ask an expert witness. This would probably be someone from the tyre company that manufactures your tyres or a senior tyre fitter (i.e.) Manager.

The question is would an expert witness from a tyre company or the area manager of kwikfit stake his multimillion pound companies name on saying your tyres fitted on the incorrect rim is safe and perfectly ok to use. My guess is probably no. If that was the case you would be in for 12 points, a fine and the court costs. This is because courts believe expert witnesses, and companies will cover their asses as much as they possibly can.

My friends advice on this was to smile sweetly to the Traffic officer, and Deny all knowledge that you had any idea it could be a problem and hope he/she take pity on you.

Hope this clears it up a bit.

[Andyboy]

If you believe that the officer has made a mistake obviously you can contest it and have your day in court.

And good luck with that. You'll need a very good solicitor and you can/will still lose and have a big fine and legal bill to add to your 12 points and massively increased insurance premium
.
Basically, fit the correct tyres for the rims. It doesn't look shite and the law won't hassle you. Easy.

[verde]

Thanks jimbo, really just a case of what the officer personally feels is within the limits by the sounds of it. Hopefully theyl be busy bothering the local chavs and their 80 mm cut springs etc tryna pick up school girls and let me go to work in peace

[pacerpete]

Thanks jimbo, really just a case of what the officer personally feels is within the limits by the sounds of it. Hopefully theyl be busy bothering the local chavs and their 80 mm cut springs etc tryna pick up school BOYS and let me go to work in peace

MMMM 80 mm cut springs ...........

[Duke137]

Nearly 6 pages of talk about stretched tyres and no Dezzy?

What happened to him, he has been quiet of late?

Is it secret room related?

[verde]

Thanks jimbo, really just a case of what the officer personally feels is within the limits by the sounds of it. Hopefully theyl be busy bothering the local chavs and their 80 mm cut springs etc tryna pick up school BOYS and let me go to work in peace

MMMM 80 mm cut springs ...........

Just the ticket i say, a nice dark green 90s corsa...chopped springs, steel wheels...cow shit allover the sides. You gotta fit a huge aitfilter too, it gives like 35 bhp gains

yeah i havnt seen dezzy post in aaaaages

[pacerpete]

Nearly 6 pages of talk about stretched tyres and no Dezzy?

What happened to him, he has been quiet of late?

Is it secret room related?

He is in A+E, he got injured trying to fit a 135 /13 to a 12" banded steelie , it was 'gape' until it burst !

[Duke137]

Nearly 6 pages of talk about stretched tyres and no Dezzy?

What happened to him, he has been quiet of late?

Is it secret room related?

He is in A+E, he got injured trying to fit a 135 /13 to a 12" banded steelie , it was 'gape' until it burst !

You come out with some shyte lol

[Morat]

So now for the crunch point. Magistrates are very unlikely to know anything about tyres. If you were to fight hard enough the crown would ask an expert witness. This would probably be someone from the tyre company that manufactures your tyres or a senior tyre fitter (i.e.) Manager.

Let me state at this point that I've always thought Dezzy is a wonderful chap, and just the sort of guy I'd let have a go on my sister (if I had one). Also, my tyres are not bald. They're just thinning a bit at the sides.

[kitch]

I've been pulled over for my wheels/tyres before and the police spent over an hour reading through their little book to find something. They couldn't find anything, put my reg on their system to say that it was ok so that I wouldn't get bothered for it again. So I really think that it is just down to the officer on the day.

[Kos]

Any your attitude

[HairyScreech]

And your attitude

This x1000. Your attitude and the way you talk to them makes all the difference, be nice and you can get away with a lot.

[verde]

And your attitude

This x1000. Your attitude and the way you talk to them makes all the difference, be nice and you can get away with a lot.

Arguing or being a dick to the police is like kicking water up hill...it doesnt work and never will. Its wasted effort, best to be polite and helpful.