dash warning light???

[bss325i]

Both pad sensors are in a loop and when the loop is broken the sensor (inside the cluster) see the change in resistance and switches the bulb (on a separate circuit) on.

But i've been right about this all along.

No one's denied this part. It's the "earthing the loop" bit that's in question.

So you admit that im right and have been all along.

Malcolm said that the wire breaks which earths out and puts the light on.

Which is wrong.

[adit]

evening Chris.
do we go to bed or break out the popcorn?

[Kemlo]

Popcorn - it's early yet.

[Brianmoooore]

Malc said the wire earths out and puts the light on. It obviously touches the disc as it's exposed as the pad wears away, before it wears right through which is obvious to anyone but you is what Malc meant.
Barry, as I've already posted you have categorically stated on several occasions in this thread that the light DOES NOT COME ON IF THE INTACT LOOP IS EARTHED. This is incorrect. I.E. You are wrong.

[bss325i]

Malc said the wire earths out and puts the light on. It obviously touches the disc as it's exposed as the pad wears away, before it wears right through which is obvious to anyone but you is what Malc meant.
Barry, as I've already posted you have categorically stated on several occasions in this thread that the light DOES NOT COME ON IF THE INTACT LOOP IS EARTHED. This is incorrect. I.E. You are wrong.

Only half wrong IF your theory is correct!

Are you going to post this diagram of yours or what?

I did ask 5 hours ago!

[adit]

Popcorn - it's early yet.

no, sod it, bed methinks

[Brianmoooore]

I'm not posting any diagram, as I don't have it in a postable (is that a word?) form. I don't do computers.
Anyone who is likely to understand the circuit if it was posted should have no difficulty in drawing out the circuit from my description.
Yes, you're half wrong, but no one's argued with the half that's correct! It's the half wrong part that you contradicted Malc on, so he's still waiting for your apology, unless you've sent it by PM.

[Game]

If both wires are touching the brake disc. The light wont be on. Simple electrics. Current takes the easiest path. It will make continuity through the disc to the other wire.
If one of the 2 wires is on the disc, or earth, the light will come on. But the pad warning light circuit would have to be broken for that to happen.

Like I said before. The design of the circuit is for it to be broken. If the design was for it to earth out. You would only need one wire.

[bss325i]

I'm not posting any diagram

So you're not going to back up what you're saying with proof?

[Brianmoooore]

If both wires are touching the brake disc. The light wont be on. Simple electrics. Current takes the easiest path. It will make continuity through the disc to the other wire.
If one of the 2 wires is on the disc, or earth, the light will come on. But the pad warning light circuit would have to be broken for that to happen.

Like I said before. The design of the circuit is for it to be broken. If the design was for it to earth out. You would only need one wire.

The design of the circuit is for the light to come on when the disc first wears through the plastic surrounding the wire in the sensor and the still intact wire touches the disc. At this stage the light will be intermittent.
Eventually the wire will wear right through, and the design is such that the light will now stay on permanently as long as the ignition is on.
This has all been explained at great length in the previous five pages!

[skipunda]

Come on bss you're an intelligent bloke. What do you think of the points raised? Do you need paperwork when the logic is explained.

[Brianmoooore]

I'm not posting any diagram

So you're not going to back up what you're saying with proof?

If you want the circuit, draw it out from my description. I worded the description carefully so that this could be done.
Most people on here won't be interested in the details of the circuit or understand it anyway. They are just interested (if at all!) in what the circuit does. (Which is: turns the light on when the disc first contacts the wire loop in the sensor, then keeps it on permanently when the wire eventually breaks, as long as the ignition is on.)

[bss325i]

I want it in black and white on an official BMW diagram because for all we know brian could be making it up. The circuit he has explained may well work to the theory he has explained but that is NO proof of what is actually inside the instrument cluster or how it actually works.

[Brianmoooore]

AFAIK, BMW have never published the diagram. The diagram I have is reverse engineered from an actual E30 cluster, the same as several other circuits I quote on here. This kind of circuit tracing is part of what I do for a living.
The 'proof' of the circuit is inside every E30 cluster, and I'm sure there are others on here capable of opening up a cluster and tracing out the circuit, the same as I did.
If you write out the circuit from my description, Barry, it shouldn't take you long to open one up and check that it matches what I've described.

[Kos]

how can any one ever listen too and take seriously anything said by the man ( yes you daimlerman) who used dulux to paint parts of his car, fitted calipers with the wrong bolts and his calipers fell off when he was driving ?

[daimlerman]

Thirdly, a simple test you can do. Take a test lamp (a bulb with two wires attached will suffice) an attach one wire to the live battery terminal and the other wire to the brake disc.
You will find that the test lamp (or bulb) will not illuminate!

So to reitterate, THE BRAKE PAD WIRE DOES NOT GROUND THROUGH THE BRAKE DISC!

Like this,Barryboy?



Looks to me that Brian,Will and myself are owed the apology......

Um,Barryboy? You were wrong here,were you not?

[skipunda]

Don't be passive aggressive, it's not his name is it. It has been noticed.

Kos, well this 'aint the time.

[daimlerman]

Don't be passive aggressive, it's not his name is it. It has been noticed.

Kos, well this 'aint the time.

If Barry acted like an adult,he would be treated like one!

[skipunda]

Haha don't give me that please. Carry on a technical discussion by all means but anything else isn't necessary.

[daimlerman]

Haha don't give me that please. Carry on a technical discussion by all means but anything else isn't necessary.

It is very noticable from my repeat post above,that Barry really does not have a clue about how this system works!

At least I can give the 'simple laymans' version.....and I feel that Brian and Will will agree with me that all the extra bits built into the circuit are there mainly to ensure that the bulb check facility works when the ign is first switched on....

Begining to wish I had taken the bloody laptop to work tonight!

[Kos]

Kos, well this 'aint the time.

[skipunda]

Kos you're a cheeky git

Ok Malcolm, I know you mean well and you deal with getting things done. Saying another member doesn't know what goes on in a system is between you and him under the observation of us but we're all adults and we all want to get the job done properly and efficiently.


Another point and I hope a final one from me. No message can ever be received well if we take things personally.

In this very rare case this may well be a case of wrong and right but lets be civil about it for the benefit of others.

As a result of this thread and recent others the team wish to bring in a proper FAQ section in the coming weeks and we need the right info to be present, delivered by the members of this very forum and perhaps vetted by the very people here tonight. This thread I'd say will probably be dealt with by a wiki team - another improvement we are bringing in slowly but steadily. We need to stand united on information sharing but everyone here realises that it takes time to get to the stage where we are comfortable with a suggestion made. Once it is made it is time to either decline with a better solution or acknowledge.

It is true the zone does require facts because that's the kind of people we are. We are entering a stage though where there are only a few BMW technicians left that know these motors from the time of build and can comment on an official level. We'd dearly love paperwork for everything but it isn't always possible and we constantly read the very high level of technical help, among the best E30 knowledge in the world I'd vouch & sometimes going beyond what was initially set out in the development suites.

Dya hear what I'm saying.

I don't like bans, I don't like locks. The mods have given it fair in this thread in response to what has been put in front of them and I wont hear a bad word about them.

[m_jermyn]

Wether your name is Barry, Brian, Will, Malcom or if your a mechanic, technician, electric engineer or just plane enthusiast all of your comments are welcome here it does not matter if you are tight or wrong.

After all we are all here for the same reason and that's because we are all pationate about these cars.

So can we please move on from this?



I for one value the imput of every single person who has been in this argument as each of you have helped me in the past, you are all extremely good at what you do and this great site would not be what it is without you, it does not matter who is right and who is wrong aslong as we get the correct answer in the end.

[snakebrain]

Skipunda hath spake..

[Dezzy]

Don't be passive aggressive, it's not his name is it. It has been noticed.

Kos, well this 'aint the time.

If Barry acted like an adult,he would be treated like one!

FFS is this still going????

Fooking hell get a grip

[Brianmoooore]

The loop circuit is there, Malc, so that the warning light doesn't go out once the pad sensor has virtually disintegrated or the wires fallen right off, having been severed by the ring of rust around the edge of the disc. BMW didn't use a simple circuit where a complicated one would do.

[m8782538]

If Brianmoooore doesn't know about it, it ain't worth knowing.

He is an encylcopedia for E30's. If he says it, good enough for almost every zoner on here. Take it as gospel, unless proven otherwise.

[The_Diddler]

If Brianmoooore doesn't know about it, it ain't worth knowing.

He is an encylcopedia for E30's. If he says it, good enough for almost every zoner on here. Take it as gospel, unless proven otherwise.

Wow , if he told you to jump of a cliff, i'd bet you'd admire the view on the way down

[daimlerman]

Don't be passive aggressive, it's not his name is it. It has been noticed.

Kos, well this 'aint the time.

If Barry acted like an adult,he would be treated like one!

FFS is this still going????

Fooking hell get a grip

Dezzy mate;

It's the 'you talk drivel' comment by Barry that hurts,particularly when he has been proved to be wrong,just look at my post,with photo,on page two,repeated last night/early morning....

[Dezzy]

Malc imo your as bad as each other.

Its been going on far too long now no? Time to let it lie i reckon.

Your both old enough to know better arnt you?

I reckon i speek for most of the regulars when i say its fooking boring

[daimlerman]

Malc imo your as bad as each other.

Its been going on far too long now no? Time to let it lie i reckon.

Your both old enough to know better arnt you?

I reckon i speek for most of the regulars when i say its fooking boring

Well,the ball is now very firmly in Barry's side of the court,he knows what he has to do....

Me?

I am quite content to let bygones be,but will Barry?

[beemerbird]

I reckon i speek for most of the regulars when i say its fooking boring

Ain't that the truth

[Dezzy]

Well i for one hope he can move on!

Come on Bazza hand shake time i reckon

[B7]

You lot still 'ere

[magpie]

i left this on page one after i answered the op's question.

do i win a doughnut