HELP caught by police with my engine converted bmw!!!!!!!

[nickso]

it does indeed highlight the question of how far do you go?

what about a blacked out kidney grill? anyone declared that?

wouldn't bother declaring that

eccentric bushes?

definitely need to declare that as a suspension mod

cloth comfort seats swapped out for sports?

again, hardly worth bothering to declare, especially if the seats were originally in an E30

leather swapped in?

same as above

what if your obc broke and you put the analogue clock back in?

now you're being silly

smileys fitted instead of prefacelift sealed beam type?

probably not...however, as it is a non-performance enhancing mod that could be seen as potentially safer, I'd consider declaring that...may even reduce your premium!

iv painted the black bumper trim on mine red, do i have to declare that?

again, not worth bothering with...

strictly any change from standard spec is a modification so they could winge about all of the above, anyone asked about stupid anal stuff?

edit: on a less anal note, what about those of us that have blown 4.11 small case diffs up and only had 3.64 medium case diffs to replace it with?

The diff mod may be worth mentioning...especially if it is in that direction as it slows the acceleration and, in the eyes of the insurance company, may be safer and reduce your premium...
But I'm willing to bet that so long as the replacement diff is an E30 one, then not even an engineer will tell the difference or know what it left the factory with...

A+ for effort.

D- for content.

all the cosmetic mods will be seen as more attractive to thieves hence why you should declare them all if you want to be 100% certain of not getting knobbled should an issue arise.

[nickso]

the problem with the insurance racket in this country is they are not in the slightest bit interested in giving you the insurance you actually need, just the insurance that feeds their profits. it's a scandal and we can't even rely on the government to ever sort it out as they are getting the biggest kickback from the scam. i really do hate the british way somedays.

[TouringTash]

could this be addressed with an overseas company.
I haven't the first idea about the legal aspects of this.
Maybe BMW Germany could do an owners worldwide policy

keeping it in the family?

[steve_k]

could this be addressed with an overseas company.
I haven't the first idea about the legal aspects of this.
Maybe BMW Germany could do an owners worldwide policy

keeping it in the family?

guess what? you can allready get your insurance through them

[capri_rob]

all the cosmetic mods will be seen as more attractive to thieves hence why you should declare them all if you want to be 100% certain of not getting knobbled should an issue arise.

Unfortuntaley with a 20+ Year old turd which has been through probably at least a handful of owners by now, unless you go to the extent of getting a factory build sheet how the hell are you supposed to know what was actually fitted when the car was new ?

With a company like BMW where they didn't bother with badging cars as L, GL, GLS, Ghia, Ghia X etc practially everything is available as an option, unless you or the insurance company bother to get an original build sheet ( would they ? I don't think so ) there is no telling what OEM upgrades could have been done over the Years.

Your base spec 316 with a 4 speed box and no options at all 25 Years later could easily have full Sport leather, headlamp wipers, OBC, 5 Speed Box, Tech 1 Wheel, Electric windows, central locking, etc etc - all of which could have been retrofitted over the cars lifetime, all of which are "cosmetic" improvements which of course make the car more desirable, but all of which could have been fitted when the car was new - yet as far as the insurer is concerned its a 316.

We're quite lucky that BMW dealers have access to such information if you want to find out the original spec of your car - I bet Ford/Vauxhall and most other manufacturers don't hold this information, or if they do won't let you access it.

No point declaring stuff which could quite realistically been on the car from new IMO

[Z3I]

the problem with the insurance racket in this country is they are not in the slightest bit interested in giving you the insurance you actually need, just the insurance that feeds their profits. it's a scandal and we can't even rely on the government to ever sort it out as they are getting the biggest kickback from the scam. i really do hate the british way somedays.

Can't really agree with that.

I think the reply from insurance companys might be that insurance buyers in this country are not the slightest bit interested in what the policy covers at the time of purchase, only in obtaining the lowest quote for anything that gives a certificate that feeds their need to comply with the law for 3rd party insurance. Just how many people actually read the policy and terms and conditions at the time of purchase?

Nobody seems to understand the risk that an insrance company takes on, when insuring somebody like the author of this thread. Its not his car that is the issue, its the 3rd party risk he represents by driving a car that he can't reasonably insure, because of the risk it represents. Claims that he could create could run to millions.

Like it or not, young men with modified cars of any description represent the greatest risk of paying out to an insurance company, so why shouldn't they charge for it. The older you get, the less risk you are, and more likely to drive a totally standard newer car, so the less you pay.

[capri_rob]

Whilst what you say is true regarding the risk to premium cost ratio, Insurance whichever way you look at it is a profit driven money making machine.

Everybody hates insurance. Nobody likes it, nobody wants to pay for it - we buy it because its a legal requirement.

People buy the cheapest because they think that if they need to make a claim there's no point paying over the odds for the cover because the insurer will find some reason to wriggle out of paying at all, or will pay out some insulting sum which you then have to haggle over for months in order to get a fair settlement. Insurers don't want to pay out because it affects their profits. Simple.

How many people buy Life insurance, Health insurance and god knows what else because they are told at the point of sale that it will cover them for all these illnesses, and then when they actually get one the insurer then says "yes we can see you've had a heart attack, but unfortunately it wasn't severe enough to warrant a payout"

Insurance is just another Tax.

[nickso]

all the cosmetic mods will be seen as more attractive to thieves hence why you should declare them all if you want to be 100% certain of not getting knobbled should an issue arise.

Unfortuntaley with a 20+ Year old turd which has been through probably at least a handful of owners by now, unless you go to the extent of getting a factory build sheet how the hell are you supposed to know what was actually fitted when the car was new ?

With a company like BMW where they didn't bother with badging cars as L, GL, GLS, Ghia, Ghia X etc practially everything is available as an option, unless you or the insurance company bother to get an original build sheet ( would they ? I don't think so ) there is no telling what OEM upgrades could have been done over the Years.

Your base spec 316 with a 4 speed box and no options at all 25 Years later could easily have full Sport leather, headlamp wipers, OBC, 5 Speed Box, Tech 1 Wheel, Electric windows, central locking, etc etc - all of which could have been retrofitted over the cars lifetime, all of which are "cosmetic" improvements which of course make the car more desirable, but all of which could have been fitted when the car was new - yet as far as the insurer is concerned its a 316.

We're quite lucky that BMW dealers have access to such information if you want to find out the original spec of your car - I bet Ford/Vauxhall and most other manufacturers don't hold this information, or if they do won't let you access it.

No point declaring stuff which could quite realistically been on the car from new IMO

good point and i agree in 99% of cases you will get away with it, but if you believe an insurance company wouldn't check the build spec with BMW if the payout was big then you are maybe being a bit naive. in the case of fire particularly, the interior changes could make a difference.

all i'm saying is be careful and not be surprised when they hit you with not paying because you didn't declare it.

[Green]

I'm 20 and been driving since I were 17, and can say that buying insurance is a grueling task that no one enjoys, over the years I'd had some stupid quotes for some cars but usually find a fairly alright one. In response to the OP apparently paying £5000 for a 325 unless you've got points or something I don't think that's possible
when I passed my rotbox 1.3 mk3 fiesta was £2200.. was paying £200 a month on a mcdonald wage! I switched to a 306 1.4 a few months later after killing the car which bought it down to £1800.
Then at 18 I had a 2.0s Capri which was a mere £1100 for the year I was loving it. Shortly afterwards I turned 19 got a fiesta 1.8 xr2i which cost me £1400 for a group 14/15 car, this followed by another 2 fiestas which were declared engine conversions for roughly the same price.. surprising as one was a rs1800 and the second a 2.1zvh turbo (That one stumped me).
Then i was using a 1.5 derv for a bit and now i'm 20 my insurance was only £1200 for a 2.0 e30... declared my 2.5 conversion just incase which has added a further £20 a month D:
better safe then sorry though. Although I doubt anyone'd tell the difference from looking at the two engines in the bay as they're pretty much identical.

Hopefully next year I'm awarded with a cheap renewal for having a years NCB on a "High performance" car as they call it...

[nickso]

the problem with the insurance racket in this country is they are not in the slightest bit interested in giving you the insurance you actually need, just the insurance that feeds their profits. it's a scandal and we can't even rely on the government to ever sort it out as they are getting the biggest kickback from the scam. i really do hate the british way somedays.

Can't really agree with that.

I think the reply from insurance companys might be that insurance buyers in this country are not the slightest bit interested in what the policy covers at the time of purchase, only in obtaining the lowest quote for anything that gives a certificate that feeds their need to comply with the law for 3rd party insurance. Just how many people actually read the policy and terms and conditions at the time of purchase?

Nobody seems to understand the risk that an insrance company takes on, when insuring somebody like the author of this thread. Its not his car that is the issue, its the 3rd party risk he represents by driving a car that he can't reasonably insure, because of the risk it represents. Claims that he could create could run to millions.

Like it or not, young men with modified cars of any description represent the greatest risk of paying out to an insurance company, so why shouldn't they charge for it. The older you get, the less risk you are, and more likely to drive a totally standard newer car, so the less you pay.

for the plebs of this world i agree, they only drive dull cars and only need dull insurance.

the problem arises when you have a car like mine, they can't insure me for what i use it for, 6 months on the road, 6 months on axle stands. i don't want them to repair it if it's salvageable and i don't want them to remove it to a yard if it's not. i don't want anyone other than the assessor to touch it. in the event of an accident that is my fault i actually don't want to claim unless it's a complete right off and nothing is salvageable from the wreck, assuming i survive that fireball. the third party can claim as normal.


i believe there are only a handful of underwriters in this country and all the brokers use the same people but add their premium onto it. OK that's business but the underwriters haven't the slightest clue what they are trying to insure. say engine swap to half of them and they shit themselves and like an incontinent old man they don't even know why. even worse if the magic words " i converted it myself" pass your lips.

i'm 36, no points for ten years, no crashes, no claims of any sort, 7 years no claims bonus, good postcode. for most normal cars with a bit of poke, jags, bmw's etc i'll be lucky if i top £200 fully comp. tried to insure the e30 with an M52, m3 suspension and no interior, dropped with arch extensions and set of hartges and some wanted close to a grand.....er no! in the event of a crash they won't even give me the price of the mods back, the pisstakers just treat it like a 320i with wheels.

maybe i'm being unrealistic but i just think they charge more because they haven't got a clue and hope that it covers any crashes.

[zaust]

when police check if the car is insured on the MIB (motor insurance database) it would have shown up as having insurance, but they obviously dont know about any declarations, which are listed seperately on the policy.
Thats why they didnt take the car there and then under operation reclaim for not having insurance, but as he stated in his post, the police said that they will follow this up !!!! They will check with his insurance company if he is insured to drive a 2.5 and when told that he isnt !!!!!

They will knock on his door and either arrest him for driving with no insurance or issue hime with a FPN (fixed penalty notice) and summons him to court

And they will take 5 month's and 29 day's to do so, so that when you think you might have just got away with it, Doh ! Brown Letter on the door mat.

[johnt0709]

Plenty of time then to get a 1.6/1.8 back in then........

[HairyScreech]

i think thats your best course of action here, get a m40 back in asap. get the cheepest closes one to hand and get it in this week.

[Kos]

i like being 30, insurance has got just a bit cheaper for me. all 3 cars done for £1200. all legit, 2 with proper agreed values and the mods declared on the compact.

when i was 20, my 325i sport was £1000 fully comp. i'd say about 1500 in todays money?

[Bob_S]

I have been lucky with insurance it seems that owning a fast car when your young and good postcode helps.
I paid 2.5g on my m3 at 19 and less than a grand on my 24v chariots.
I'm 23 now with 3 yrs ncb and it's still not cheap imo, I pay 1500 for 2 cars on an admiral multi policy. What I have found is that insuring fast standard cars is cheaper than modified old ones and less run of the mill stuff is cheaper. M3's are a pain to insure and dear as are honda vtec and generally anything that the insurance companies think are a bit lairy and liable to crashing

[Jamese30]

Try heritage motor insurance or carol nash. My car (originally a 320i) has a modified 2.7 fitted and ALL modifications are listed with carol nash who insure me. You simply cannot not list your modifications. Obviously you will potentially be charged more for your insurance BUT you are then completely legal. IN addition the insurance company has a clearer idea of exactly what your car is so when it comes to a pay out in the event of a write off you are more likely to get a larger percentage of what you have spent on the car back.

[Jim320i]

Do I need to declare to my insurance about my stereo system as its not stock? Aha... Anyway, if you decide to actually just sell it and buy an original 325i, I'll have your modded one.

[rhubarb]

bung the original engine back in it...

otherwise register it with the dvla as a 2.5 lump, and insure is as modified, but they could well ask

for an engineers report..

Have the brakes and suspension been uprated to suit?

[magpie]

another.

[silversideofthemoon]

If you are too poor to pay for insurance do not drive.

brilliant, ppl like this doing stupid things, like this to avoid insurance costs its why is so high in the firstv place .work the hours save the cash and do itr properly.......................i have to ,i have 3 kids a mortgage and am 32 pay a skin full out to insurance companies fedn up but gotta be done wouldnt think of doin a conversion and not tellin them crash ye lose ye dosh ye forked out crash and hit some one kill them ...anythink .......welll says it all if ye cant afford it dont drive ..........thats my rant over if ye think am wrong bar me ...!!

[Dezzy]

If you are too poor to pay for insurance do not drive.

brilliant, ppl like this doing stupid things, like this to avoid insurance costs its why is so high in the firstv place .work the hours save the cash and do itr properly.......................i have to ,i have 3 kids a mortgage and am 32 pay a skin full out to insurance companies fedn up but gotta be done wouldnt think of doin a conversion and not tellin them crash ye lose ye dosh ye forked out crash and hit some one kill them ...anythink .......welll says it all if ye cant afford it dont drive ..........thats my rant over if ye think am wrong bar me ...!!

Here writes the man who has had a skin full. Just a guess?

[silversideofthemoon]

hahaha not really dezzy, like were ye coming from though , just dont condone it mate if ye can afford to buy it , run it , ie on 2.5 which isnt a vary expensive ru,nner as i have a 535i v8 e39 and a 3.9v8 rangey then you can afford to tell the insurance simple as ok ppl dont declare alloys or stereos but blaggin engines come ..........

[aeberbach]

So let's say you had some kind of smash. The insurance inspector takes a peek, as they do... what then?

Or is this just the compulsory must-have cover that some places require? Where I live it's part of the yearly registration charge.

[magpie]

given most of the above if the op or an uninsured driver crashed into me i'd expect them to suffer a bit more than whiplash.

[Dezzy]

Earlier in the post I stated my opinion on driving with no insurance mate. It was along the same lines as yours. I wasn't quite as p1ssed though.

[magpie]

Earlier in the post I stated my opinion on driving with no insurance mate. It was along the same lines as yours. I wasn't quite as p1ssed though.

glad were both @ home, safe.

[roy46ss]

After reading through this thread noticed that in everyons case the insurance quote always goes up. Has anyone ever had a quote for cheaper insurance seeing as the car is safer because of the modifications...?? I know I have spent alot of money on my 320i as regards suspension, bigger brakes and a 325 sport kit in prepation for a b25 or some 24v power depending on cost (being 21 and a student makes it hard to run an E30) but to be honest I've never thought of declareing any thing other than the billies and spring's I wonder if declareing the brakes will reduce it..? Oh and by the way 4 years no claims, no points and I'm paying around 800 euro a year.

[jaffacake]

my insurance is £2300 with my mum on it, i'm 18, and it costs the same to insure a bloody VAUXHALL CORSA 1.2 1999, so stick ur mum or dad on it and u as a named driver, and get a new 325i not a 316 cuz like sumone said, its a MOD abd gunna cost more. most classic insurance u have to be at least 21 and some 25 yrs old. get a decent paid job like me and then u can afford to do it propperley mate

[capri_rob]

my insurance is £2300 with my mum on it, i'm 18, and it costs the same to insure a bloody VAUXHALL CORSA 1.2 1999, so stick ur mum or dad on it and u as a named driver, and get a new 325i not a 316 cuz like sumone said, its a MOD abd gunna cost more. most classic insurance u have to be at least 21 and some 25 yrs old. get a decent paid job like me and then u can afford to do it propperley mate

Doing it properly is NOT insuring it in your mum or dads name and then adding yourself as a named driver - this has been done to death and is not legit - you may as well have no insurance at all as when the insurers investigate if you have a crash and find out that you are the main/only driver of the vehicle - not your mum or dad - they will not pay out.

If you're the main driver you need to insure it in your name end of story.

[HairyScreech]

he means as a named driver not fronting it.

[SDM]

still no pics of this chariot

[Liam554]

To think I'm on £2700 for a 318.. though it's probably worth it when I inevitably get pulled.

[skyinsurance]

As someone who works in one of the UK's most hated industries, I'm probably playing with fire by even posting on this thread but I just want to say, the days of difficulty of insuring a modified car is a thing of the past.
There are a lot of specialists out there who cater for modified cars, engine swapped cars, imports etc this really should not be an issue. If you cannot afford the insurance on a modified car then you should not be driving it. If you cannot afford the insurance becuase of your age on a high performance or modified car, you shouldn't be driving it. High insurance prices for young/new drivers is not a new thing, back in 1998 when I was 17, my insurance cost £1300TPFT on a MG Metro which was worth under £500.

Strictly speaking every change to the vehicle from when it left the factory should be declared to the insurer, if you are unsure if your car is modified, I'm afraid it is down to you to get it checked out, pleading ignorance if you have a claim may not work.

Please bare in mind that I work for an insurance company, I am not a representative of the insurance company as a whole

Ollie
Sky Insurance

[johnt0709]

If you cannot afford the insurance on a modified car then you should not be driving it. If you cannot afford the insurance becuase of your age on a high performance or modified car, you shouldn't be driving it. High insurance prices for young/new drivers is not a new thing, back in 1998 when I was 17, my insurance cost £1300TPFT on a MG Metro which was worth under £500.



Couldnt agree more - its a high premium for a reason - to deter younger more inexperieced drivers from driving cars that may be more powerful than their ability.

Wouldn't want a 17 year old ploughing into my wife and kids in a modified 2.5l........

having said that premiums across the board are higher than they should be (im sure a multitude of reasons for this)

[skyinsurance]

having said that premiums across the board are higher than they should be (im sure a multitude of reasons for this)

Agreed, in my personal opinion the way the UK insurance system works is a bit of a farce when compared to other countries but the system is in place, we should ALL abide by it and drive legally.