Strut brace, what to get?

[E30BeemerLad]

Tim are you madder than mad john mc mad from madcastle!!!!

£300 bullits for a strut brace, mate you need help

Are you on a particular strength of green that isn't available outside of Spixworth lol

[e30bmlover]

Tim are you madder than mad john mc mad from madcastle!!!!

£300 bullits for a strut brace, mate you need help

Are you on a particular strength of green that isn't available outside of Spixworth lol

lmao... yeah im mad as a hatter mate!! but its schnitzer... and its rare!! my goal is to have in my posession....
1/ the aero kit ...... check(except boot spoiler)
2/ 16'' wheels....... check...
3/ wing mirrors...... got a set on hold lol
4/ strut brace....... working on it lol
5/ steering wheel...... next on my list...
6/ pedal set..... check..
7/ schnitzer stripes.... check
8/ two @uck off schnitzer decals for the bottom rear quaters.... check.
im on the vodka and coke at the moment my second pint, then i will roll a fat one... next time you are over this way pop in... i will give you a sample

[e30bmlover]

Don't offend the touring massive - we've got room for all of you in the boot ;)

lol... i dont doubt that.

[handpaper]

Handpaper...for road cars and show cars there is no problem with hinged ones due to the stress they are under...the Sparco one is solid as are Hartge (twin tube) they can be a git to fit and often do need to jack one side as someone else said...race cars have them solid to maintain torsion...BUT some E30s with Carbon Air Boxes etc sometimes dont have a brace BUT have a full cage with triangulation (without hinges )

I'm trying to explain, but you're not listening. I'm happy for you to remain ignorant if that is your wish, but I'd prefer that others here weren't confused by you unfounded assertions.
Firstly, yes, unhinged braces are usually better than hinged. That's why I recommended (and bought!) the Sparco brace above.
The reasons, however, have nothing to do with rigidity.

Many 'race grade' braces don't include hinges because a hinge is a wear point/weak point and a manufacturing complication which makes the brace heavier and more expensive. The main advantage of a hinge is that it can make the brace easier to fit for the amateur without access to a comprehensive workshop, not a problem for most race teams

Your assertion that "race cars have [strut braces] solid to maintain torsion" is demonstrably nonsense.
Look at the picture of the Sparco brace below. It mounts to the car using the inner two of the three top mount fixing positions on each side of the car. These are parallel with the front-rear axis of the car and provide no useful resistance to forces acting outside this line.



To clarify, imagine the mount bolts as nails in a packing crate lid and the bar as a crowbar. Push sideways against the lid with the crowbar and nothing much will happen - the nails are well placed to resist this force. This is the force vector the brace is designed to handle.

Now imagine the crowbar forced under the lid of the crate. Push upward on the free end and the nails, under huge mechanical disadvantage, will be pulled out. The structure is not designed to withstand this force and fails.

Looking closely at the Sparco brace, it becomes clear that the designer was aware of this and made an allowance for it. If you examine the mount holes, you will see that the metal 'dimples' around them - when mounted, only a small area arount the holes will actually be in contact with the car; the 'crowbar' has no purchase at its tip and can only bend the nails, not pull on them.
In other words, the Sparco brace is designed to allow movement at its mounting points to compensate for its not being hinged!

As for caged race cars not needing braces, I'd disagree there too (sorry!). To prevent two points moving toward/away from each other, nothing can substitute for a rigid member linking them. A properly caged car may not suffer the same strut tower movement as a car without, but it will still be there and a brace will still reduce it.

[e30bmlover]

Handpaper...for road cars and show cars there is no problem with hinged ones due to the stress they are under...the Sparco one is solid as are Hartge (twin tube) they can be a git to fit and often do need to jack one side as someone else said...race cars have them solid to maintain torsion...BUT some E30s with Carbon Air Boxes etc sometimes dont have a brace BUT have a full cage with triangulation (without hinges )

I'm trying to explain, but you're not listening. I'm happy for you to remain ignorant if that is your wish, but I'd prefer that others here weren't confused by you unfounded assertions.
Firstly, yes, unhinged braces are usually better than hinged. That's why I recommended (and bought!) the Sparco brace above.
The reasons, however, have nothing to do with rigidity.

Many 'race grade' braces don't include hinges because a hinge is a wear point/weak point and a manufacturing complication which makes the brace heavier and more expensive. The main advantage of a hinge is that it can make the brace easier to fit for the amateur without access to a comprehensive workshop, not a problem for most race teams

Your assertion that "race cars have [strut braces] solid to maintain torsion" is demonstrably nonsense.
Look at the picture of the Sparco brace below. It mounts to the car using the inner two of the three top mount fixing positions on each side of the car. These are parallel with the front-rear axis of the car and provide no useful resistance to forces acting outside this line.



To clarify, imagine the mount bolts as nails in a packing crate lid and the bar as a crowbar. Push sideways against the lid with the crowbar and nothing much will happen - the nails are well placed to resist this force. This is the force vector the brace is designed to handle.

Now imagine the crowbar forced under the lid of the crate. Push upward on the free end and the nails, under huge mechanical disadvantage, will be pulled out. The structure is not designed to withstand this force and fails.

Looking closely at the Sparco brace, it becomes clear that the designer was aware of this and made an allowance for it. If you examine the mount holes, you will see that the metal 'dimples' around them - when mounted, only a small area arount the holes will actually be in contact with the car; the 'crowbar' has no purchase at its tip and can only bend the nails, not pull on them.
In other words, the Sparco brace is designed to allow movement at its mounting points to compensate for its not being hinged!

As for caged race cars not needing braces, I'd disagree there too (sorry!). To prevent two points moving toward/away from each other, nothing can substitute for a rigid member linking them. A properly caged car may not suffer the same strut tower movement as a car without, but it will still be there and a brace will still reduce it.

sweet.... nice brace...

[Cabrio]

Handpaper - you best explain this to the guys on the Kumho, BTCC, and many other race series as they may all be doing it wrong...the E30 thats leading the Kumho for example has no bar at all...glad you have your bar and are happy thats the important thing...and good we agree that a solid bar is better

[Bob_S]

handpaper, what you havnt seen on the sparco brace are the two wings that sit tight against the inner of the strut tower and are supposed to be bolted down through the side of the tower.

The clutch resevoir is easy to avoid, you want to unbolt it, line rotate it clockwise until it's clear of the bar, mark a line on it, remove from the car, cut the bracket side off as far as you need and replace on the car and bolt it down, easy.
You will notice that the throttle cable(s) are also affected, this is over come by bending the cruise bracket down a bit and bend the normal throttle cable mount 180 degrees so the cable comes in over the top of the bar.. I have done this and had no issues.
I cant really say it's had any detrimental effect on the car but at the same time I cant tell much difference in the behaviour as I upgraded a few items at the same time

p.s I dont see why you would want a bar which has variables in such as the adjustable type or whatever they are called

[handpaper]

Bob, the Sparco in the picture above was the one I fitted to my old 320i. The wings do not 'sit tight' against the strut tower and there is no provision for attaching them there.
Even if you were to drill attachment points in the brace and strut tower sides and bolt them together (with the appropriate spacer) it still wouldn't noticeably improve stiffness as the strut tower isn't designed to be stiff in that direction and would simply distort under any load.
Sparco built the brace that way to make it light, strong and cheap, that's all.

WRT your PS - adjustable bars are usually muti-fit and cover more than one model. They can also be used to correct chassis sag or even alter camber - pulling the towers toward each other will increase negative camber.

[Dave_M3]

Will the Sparco brace fit the iS, does anybody know?

Cool, I'm setting up a tent on here now...
1000 posts, lol

[BMracing]

Any opinions on this OMP bar?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/OMP-Aluminium-Str ... dZViewItem

I see people have mixed opinions on hinges. Although i guess the one in the pic might not be for an e30.
It looks nice and simple otherwise, and no doubt light. Bit pricey though

[aretha]

Hi Dave M3

When I was making similar enquiry re strut brace for my 318iS from Evolve (on Zone) the guy thought the Sparco one might fit but he said the Weichler one definitely would. FritzBitz, probably not good for you though as they're in Somerset would make and fit one to my car. Price was similar to Weichler. I've bought neither and still don't have one.

Hope this is a bit helpful - good luck in your search

[Bob_S]

Bob, the Sparco in the picture above was the one I fitted to my old 320i. The wings do not 'sit tight' against the strut tower and there is no provision for attaching them there.
Even if you were to drill attachment points in the brace and strut tower sides and bolt them together (with the appropriate spacer) it still wouldn't noticeably improve stiffness as the strut tower isn't designed to be stiff in that direction and would simply distort under any load.
Sparco built the brace that way to make it light, strong and cheap, that's all.

WRT your PS - adjustable bars are usually muti-fit and cover more than one model. They can also be used to correct chassis sag or even alter camber - pulling the towers toward each other will increase negative camber.

They have changed the design for the one I bought a month ago then.. as it has holes to mount it to the strut towers and it is a tight fit to the towers aswell

[Cabrio]

In fact ↓↓↓

This one will fit all E30 models without mods...if it does not fit I will pay the return post and they are cheaper than Sparco and have a warrenty...so a win win

[Cabrio]

BMRacing - I can get a discount on the OMP one but why waste your money as the UR and Sparco are fit for purpose and half the money...cheers

[Simon13]

the single sparco strut brace is the best you can get for a strut brace which does what it's supposed to do.

No loading on the strut top mounts as they spread the load by mounting on the side of the towers

[Dave_M3]

I got a second hand OMP brace that was the hinged type but getting rid of it again I think...

I'd like some Sparco ones but not sure of the fit on my car...

Do those ones in the pic have the reinforcing side plates too Automac?

[BMracing]

BMRacing - I can get a discount on the OMP one but why waste your money as the UR and Sparco are fit for purpose and half the money...cheers

PM'd regarding the UR one.

[Cabrio]

You will have to call me as when tried to reply got this message:

Sorry, but the administrator has prevented you from sending private messages

[BMracing]

Automac,

I can't call you because you sig has disappeared that had your number in!

[Cabrio]

Check out

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... :IT&ih=011

[BMracing]

Cheers for your quick response mate, zaust sent me that link earlier. I was wondering if you could get me one by the weekend though as you said they were available for next day delivery?

Cheers,

Max

[Cabrio]

Anything is possible...would like to help you on here you will have to wait until I pay to be a trader so cant sell on the zone till then...

Where are you racing

[BMracing]

I've got a track morning next tues at Brands. Cheers mate, no biggie, i'll wait for the auction to run.