Andys E30 328i

[Andy325i]

Hi guys, this is just to keep you up to date with my M52 swap, for those of you that are interested.

My Project shell is a 1990 320i



Here is the old M20 still in the car:



and here is the new M52:

[Andy325i]

On tuesday I was running about getting more bits....

I got 2 Mk 2 Golf Servo's to try, one 8v, the other a late/16v unit




On the left the late/16v one, the other the normal golf one.

I also ordered the following: (dealer)

Sump gasket (pn: 11.13.1.437.237)
Throttle body o ring (pn: 11.61.1.716.174)
Waterpump o ring (pn: 11.51.1.711.484)
M50 Inlet rubbers x 6 (pn: 11.61.1.720.740)

erm.... sure there was more

I stripped down the M52 removing the following:

Air Con pump and Housing (less weight )

M52 Wiring loom

328i Manifold as I am going to use the 325i item for better gas flow (the 2.5 inlet manifold has bigger ports).

In the picture below you can see the rubber seals on both manifolds are the same size, but the 328i manifold (left) has a lot smaller ports.





Next I had to change the Injectors over 328i are pink 325i are green.
Other than that the look identical. Not sure of the flow rates, but am trying to find out





Looked at swapping the whole fuel rail over but this wouldn't work without modification as the holes to secure it to the inlet manifold are in a slightly different place
(Black fuel rail is M50, silver is M52)



These are the Manifolds:



328i V 325i

NOTE: The 328i manifold seals are all joined together, where as the M50 ones are all seperate.

So the outcome is, I will use the 325i inlet manifold, throttle body and injection rail, with 328i injectors.

waterpump to check if it was a metal type (earlier ones had plastic impellers which used to break up leaving you with a useless waterpump!!!!
Later updated ones use a metal impeller like this one:



I also removed the Plastic thermostat housing, as I am changing it for a Aluminum type from Turner Motorsport in the USA.





This is the link to it on their website:
Click here

Also from Turner Motorsport I ordered the adaptor for the back of the waterpump. The M50 uses a rubber "T" shape hose to go from the back or the waterpump to the heater matrix, and also to connect to the expansion bottle. After looking at the M52 one, I discovered that it is a metal "T" pipe which I think is a better design, so I am planning not to use the adaptor and insted stick with the metal pipe, as I think this is a better idea.

This is the pipe on thier website:
Click here

[glenn]

nice project andy,
hope it gives you as much pleasure doing it as mine,
keep us posted with plenty of pics

[Andy325i]

Cheers Glenn, got LOTS of pictures, how far is yours now?

I think we should have a meet when they are all up and running

[Toby_Unna]

nice wheels on that 320 andy

good effort putting the 325 manifold on, my friend's e36 has that mod and it goes like a rocket, quicker than my m535i!

[Andy325i]

nice wheels on that 320 andy

Personally not my cup of tea, but I think they look ok when finished well.

If anyone is interested in them at a sensible price, just let me know.

More info

I have some nice 16" Crosspokes to go on

[Andy325i]

good effort putting the 325 manifold on, my friend's e36 has that mod and it goes like a rocket, quicker than my m535i!

What E36 is it mate?

[Andy335Touring]

are you doing a five lug hub swap ?

[Toby_Unna]

a shagged old 320i 4dr with a towbar and a lot of rust holes!

with a later 328i engine put in, with unknown mods other than the manifold. i think it might have different cams because it makes a lot of power! e36 weigh at least as much as e28s and it will comfortably pull away from my e28 m535i (218bhp) in all gears

[Andy325i]

are you doing a five lug hub swap ?

Sure am, got some E36 Evo front legs and Compact rear arms

[jmc330i]

On the left the late/16v one, the other the normal golf one.

How come the the 2 golf servos are so different in size?
Its a bit hard to tell from the pic but the one on the left, the late/16v one seems about the same size as the E30 servo.
Are you using the smaller golf servo? I would of thought it would be better just for space reasons.

What does the smaller golf servo measure across the front? I might look at that as an option for mine.

Cheers

[Andy325i]

Hi mate, you need to use the bigger of the Mk 2 golf sevo's as this is a bit smaller than the E30 one, the smaller one doesn't have enough reserve vacuum for heavy braking. will be fitting mine in the next few days so will post the pics as soon as I do

There is some great info here and pics of it here:

http://www.e30zone.co.uk/modules.php?na ... 2071#72071

[Andy325i]

Hi guys, web host is finally back up so I can give you some more pics (I know you love 'em )

The M20 is out and sold, currently residing in an E34 now

Here is what I am left with:


I will be removing the redundent bits from the engine bay and swapping the brake servo over as soon as poss.

I can of course loose the Coil as the M50 has individual coil packs and the Power steering fluid bottle as it is located on the new engine



Next I have been stripping the M52 down, so far I have removed the

inlet manifold, wiring loom, water pump, thermostat and housing and sump.

It now looks like this:






we also removed the block from the 525i donor car to get the sump


Here are the 2 sumps:




More soon.......

[Ziggy]

Great project Andy; that's gonna be a proper nice car!
I love reading about progress on these things... I'll start one myself one day!

nice wheels on that 320 andy

If anyone is interested in them at a sensible price, just let me know.

How much is a reasonable price? & are they in nead of re-painting or just a very good clean?!

[Andy325i]

Hi guys just an update on my progress to date:

The E34 Oil pickup and sump is back on now, we had to leave the M52 baffle plate in place and remove the M50 one from the sump (carefully grind the four weld points holding it in place)





The waterpump is back in with new rubber O-Ring in place and new thermostat and uprated thermostat housing fitted.

Also fitted is the front crank sensor and front pully both from the E34, the pully is different from the M52 in that it has the cut out in a different place





To change the the Cam sensor we had to remove the Vanos Solenoid


Here is the rear of the vanos unit itself



and the solenoid




Going to get the cam sensor this week. People want silly money for s/h so will just get a new one for Ԛ£35 from GSF. Job done (I hope!)

Also because I am using the OBD II vanos unit I need to extend the wires to reach the ODB I loom, to do this I am using Pn:B12.52.2.274.971

This is actually something to do with the reverse lights on an E36 M3 (US only) so needed to be imported from germany Cost Ԛ£12.64 but is well worth it to save chopping wires about imho
This is about 18" to 24" long.



As for the car itself I have steam cleaned the Engine bay and subframe



Fitted the E36 rack loosely (currently having the spacers made)



I have got my Joint back now, which I am most impressed with



and in place......






Tonight I fitted the Clutch kit, gearbox and starter motor, all ok, but it appears that when in gear the 'box is not connected to the engine. Great!!!
Me thinks I will be stripping it again on sunday to investigate! DAM!



The 525i and 328i starters are different in physical size, the 328i one has threads in the holes (525i one doesn't) and the 525i one has a support braket to the rear which bolts onto the block.



Last but not least for now I am working on the brake servo issue

Here is the spacer so far



These need cutting down and modifing, more on this soon!

This is where they go.....



More soon, need to sleep now!

[Toby_Unna]

just out of interest... why aren't you using the m52 loom?

looking fab anyway, the steering joint is beautifully made!

odd about the lack of drive - either the release mechanism is jammed or there's no clutch plate installed or the clutch isn't bolted tight to the flywheel?? can't think of anything else, maybe incorrect clutch parts!

[Jhonno]

what you doin with the smaller golf servo? be interested in some beer tokens for it?

[Andy325i]

just out of interest... why aren't you using the m52 loom?

looking fab anyway, the steering joint is beautifully made!

odd about the lack of drive - either the release mechanism is jammed or there's no clutch plate installed or the clutch isn't bolted tight to the flywheel?? can't think of anything else, maybe incorrect clutch parts!

hi mate, not using the M52 Loom as I am converting the engine to run on OBD I management. (Post '95 cars were OBD II) The original reason for this was because I was told that you couldn't use ODB II (EWS security system) in an E30 because you need the OBD II ECU (not a problem) and Key. Have seen a 2.8 conversion using the E36 dash, so he could use the E36 key. Looked ok but not for me! I have since learned that it is possible to use just part of the Key barrel (transponder???) and still keep the E30 Key as normal. Didn't know this until I had already started down the OBD I route, so going to stick with it (for now at least). It is supposed to release more power as well, which if it does will be great, but not holding my breath!

I am 100% sure about the things you metion about the cluch (they went through my mind too ) so am at a loss with it atm, sure its something simple just don't know what yet

Andy

[Jhonno]

where'd you get the steering joint done btw? n how muchos?

[Andy325i]

I paid for one golf servo, as I know him he said take both and bring back whichever you don't use. Made the steering joint up myself using Ians excellent guide in the tech section. Got a mate to make up the 10mm spacer etc.

[Andy325i]

Hi guys, haven't written for a while so thought I would bring you up to date.

The engine and Gearbox is in place, all in and sorted, gearbox mount as well, even semi-wired in!

The E36 rack is in there, but I wasn't to keen on how far the joint fitted onto the rack shaft see here,(altough looking at the E36 M3 rack and joint I have sitting in the garage it sits in exactly the same place lol), so I tried to fit the 14mm spacers underneath the rack to push it up towards the joint, although this didn't work because the ribs on the rack rub against the sump So I have had an 18mm spacer made up for the joint and hope this is a bit more sucessful

As a few of you know I was having a few headaches sourcing a propshaft, but that finally arrived so all was well in the end.

In the meantime the car got broken into where it was so that week I insured and taxed it, replaced the window and towed the car home. A couple of weeks passed and I ordered the boot lock and fitted it so that I could get to all the bits I needed to continue! That done and on with the project!

Next thing to get was the E36 Gearlinkage, so I tried various E30 bits we had laying around the workshop but in the end decided that the E36 option would probably be a better bet, so set about finding one, saw a guy had some E36 bits for sale on Flea bay, so mailed him, "Yeah I have it Ԛ£20 + Ԛ£5 Postage. Sorted! Or not!

I have been waiting 8 weeks now, and after countless phonecalls have heard evey excuse under the sun as to why it is not here!

Sick of this I phoned him toady(got yet another excuse! ) and told him just send the money back. Time will tell. Have decided to get all the bits from the dealear now (unless anyone knows where a 6cyl E36 one is cheap!)
Called them today and it is about 60 quid for all the bits, but at least I can get on with it again!


Does anyone know if the Z4 shifter will work correctly in a 24valve setup?


After this is sorted I have the following to do

Exhaust mainifold

Coolent pipes

Fit Inlet manifold

Electric Fan

Power steering pipes

and I'm sure 101 other little things lol!

Sorry for the bit of a rant, but I just want it running!

Andy

[jonbuoy]

This sound's brilliant mate, at an estimate how much would you say it's all gonna set you back?
Might need to get a loan as i want to do the 3.2 conversion.

[Dominitry]

Ohhhh just seeing this thread now, hell of a read and now i know what your msn name is about

Gonna be sweet when done!

[Emotechnik]

Great article and really interesting pictures, could you tell me if the cylinder head ports are matched to the original manifolds, and if so, have you done anything with the step that comes from having a large port manifold and small port head?



]

[koos]

I know it's a bit late but could the clutch plate be in the wrong way round? Seen it being done on a Sprinter before, not sure about the beemer.

[Andy325i]

Here is what I've been working on today





This is for the top hose using the M52 top hose and the E30 radiator

Emotechnik - Not sure about the port sizes, will check and let u know

Jonbuoy - Not sure about the cost but I'm sure it would frighten me to think about it!


Andy

[Sirnixalot]

im looking to do a similar project but with the 2.5 from a 525.

I would also like to use the odb1 but i dont see how the m20's ecu will control the ignition, also will you be retaining the AFM or converting to the MAF?

Also what engine & tranny mounts are you using?

good luck! cant wait to see this thing finished

[Drew325iS]

Please keep us posted on your conversion. I have an M52B28 in my garage to go into the 325is....so I'm very keen to know how you go with it!

[Andy325i]

Hi guys, it is running on an M50 ECU (413) not M20. I will be keeping the M50 Maf (for now at least

Andy

[Kilomph]

So how's she running? Pictures? Videos? Dyno charts? ANYTHING!!

Can't wait to swap an aluminum m52b28

[Andy325i]

Hi, Still not running yet! Have got all the new gearlinkage parts from the stealers now. Just waiting on a couple of breather hoses so that I can put the inlet manifold back on. I just dream of the day!

Will keep you posted


Andy

[sheldo]

wow Andy only just seen this topic and i must say i am well impressed.

the pictures and detail all make for an excellent read as this route had crossed my mind.

Good luck with the project and keep us all posted cant wait to hear the finished result

[stevetigger]

AWESOME AWESOME

[Andy325i]

Before we fitted the engine we changed the sump/oil pickup etc.


We also stripped the M52 loom and inlet manifold off of it:



Here you can see the two water outlets in the M52 head, the front hole is where the temp sender is fitted and the rear is actually for a water pipe. This setup differs from the OBD1 setup where insted of the 2 temp senders (Blue - ECU and brown - temp gauge) just one is used on the M52



To the right of the temp sender here you can see that there is a blank that could be tapped. In the '96 M52's these were actually drilled and tapped and blanked off, so would be ideal for fitting the 2 temp senders, but I didn't have this luck as it's a '97 engine, thus I had to find someway of making the two senders fit. I could have drilled and tap the head (didn't fancy this much!), so devised this:



This is the water outlet that is situated further back in the head (used to circulate warter around the throttle block) modified to accept the brown temp sender. This was done by a friend who works in a machine shop

The 2 holes in the M52 head are the same thread (4 pin temp sender and water outlet) The M50 temp blue ECU temp sender is the same as these, so no problem, but the brown one was a different thread and therefore couldn't be simply screwed into the head.

I decided to fit the engine and gearbox in one unit so thought this would be easier to do by dropping the front suspension, fitting it to the crossmember and then fitting it back into the car:















Next the M50 loom was fitted and with great help from Brian and Ian I found out where all it all pluged up. (Big thanks guys )

Here it is looking a bit messy



Next I fitted all the coolet hoses etc and then the inlet manifold



Here you can see the inlet manifold fitted with the new inlet elbow. when I fitted the original M50 elbow I found that the outlet on it foweled the brake master cylinder



With the help of Stu I discovered that BMW actually made 2 different elbows with the outlets in different places:



and with it fitted from underneath:



I have used a K & N 57i induction kit for the moment, but this will be getting changed as soon as I can find a better replacement or if not at least heat shielded for better performance.

I have also swapped the front pully back to the origial M52 as I found out this is what was used on all M50/M52's the only exception being the M50 non vanos for 1992

With a little playing about we got the M52 to start up pretty much like it had just been swiched off (Pretty impressive I think considering it hadn't run for 2 years!

There is a short clip of this here

Still a lot of work to do but its getting there

Could you tell me if the cylinder head ports are matched to the original manifolds, and if so, have you done anything with the step that comes from having a large port manifold and small port head?

]

I have spoken to someone(?) recently and they confirmed that the M52 ports are the same size as the M50 inlet manifold ports

More soon!

Andy

[m-dtech]

all i can say is awesome