E30 Zone

Just failed my MOT due to corroded rear brake pipes.

The garage thinks that this will cost £400 including 6 hours of labour , is this right???

How difficult is this to do DIY, and what is involved??

thats ridiculous .

i changed 2 pipes on my car for mot and they were £13 from the dealers and took 1 hour to fit and bleed.

Sounds like they are planning on dropping the cross-member to get access to the 3 way.

Why don't manufacturers just fit decent copper-nickel ones in the first place?

Hi I got mine done for £140. at the garage that was doing my MOT.I have a Tourer which might make a difference.Have you went elsewhere for a quote?

£100-£150 is to be expected. Just shop around....

and the reason BMW dont fit better ones is that they make cars to make a profit, and survive, which is why BMW are one of the most sucessful companys of our time. Otherwise they'd be called Rover..

I personally think it's scandalous that they are permitted to fit ones that rust. [Ralph Nader rant over.]

My advise would be then to avoid

Woodley Auto Centre
Unit 6, Headley road east,
Woodley
Reading
RG5 4SW

01189 440009

john325tewerin wrote:Sounds like they are planning on dropping the cross-member to get access to the 3 way.

Which is completely unnecessary, I replaced the 2 short pipes, T-piece, clips and changed the flexi's for Goodridge hoses on mine without removing any other parts in just over an hour including bleeding.

There's only about £5 of pipe and fittings in the whole car if you buy a flaring tool and make your own from cunnifer pipe.
Chop all the old pipes off, including the flexibles to the trailing arms. If you can turn the whole tee piece it makes starting to undo it easier.
Get new fixing clips for the end of the flexibles.
The length of brake pipe that runs the length of the car doesn't normally rust, so I usually make an inline join just in front of the rear left wheelarch.

Z3I wrote:and the reason BMW dont fit better ones is that they make cars to make a profit,

Not true. BMW considered that copper or copper alloy lines could fracture because of 'work hardening' caused by vibration.
In practice, it's fracture caused by rust that tends to be the greater problem.

I think it was on the Zone I read that getting to the tee piece was awkward, and a garage would drop the cross-member & tank to get to it. However, if you do it yourself, you can reroute the pipes around the tank.

Getting to the T-piece is a doddle compared to tightening the new pipes onto the flexi's through the brackets either side of the tunnel

I read somewhere that in olden days, it used to part of a special service to remove of the pure copper pipe and anneal it to reverse the onset of cracking due to vibration. Would have been an expensive service. Maybe as much as 12' 6d

cut the old pipes off, unbolt the t-piece put it in a vice to get the old unions out, hard part is getting new pipes the right shape, screw new pipes into t-piece , bolt t-piece back up and then slip the spring clips back on, the 180 over the top of the fuel tank s annoying

Loads of advice there thanks guys.
So what do i need to buy to replace the rear pipes and what exactly is involved?

Reading about all those hard-to-get-at joints etc, if you havn't got a nice ramp or garage with a pit, I'd still shop around for a better price. My Touring failed on rear brake pipes, headlamp fixing, and wipers and they charged me £135 last year at Hillingdon MOT centre. Seemed ok at the time as it included retest.
I still think with cars 15 years old or over we can't complain about brake pipes rusting, or anything else either. Almost everthing else of the period has been consigned long ago to the dump, whereas E30s still continue to be on the road in large numbers. When they built them, they got it right.

DanThe wrote:

john325tewerin wrote:Sounds like they are planning on dropping the cross-member to get access to the 3 way.

Which is completely unnecessary, I replaced the 2 short pipes, T-piece, clips and changed the flexi's for Goodridge hoses on mine without removing any other parts in just over an hour including bleeding.

Dan's right, If you pay attention to what you're doing they can be done with evertything left in place. I did mine in a couple of hours from standard axle stands under the rear. It's not easy, but it can be done. I would advise getting a 'proper' 11mm brake pipe spanner from somewhere, halfords? and a 14mm spanner for the hose ends. If the hoses are stubborn to undo then cut them off and use a 14mm socket on them.

The rear brake pipe set is only about 2 metres of tube in total. The worst bits are from the tee piece to the inner flexi's. The trailing arms are easy to do. Don't forget if you buy the brake pipe it must be 3/16" (4.76mm) and the unions are M10x1.0

Oh, and if you don't want to make and flare the brake pipes yourself, then order the four pipes from the dealer and bend them as required. OK, they are steel but they will probably outlast the rest of an E30's life!

If you want the pipes made in Kunifer then drop me a PM and I can preflare and bend a set specifically for the rear and send them to you.

The disadvantage of using dealer pipes is that you have to make the very tight bends near the tee piece in order for the other ends to reach where they should. Making your own, you can make them that tiny bit longer, and ease off on the radius of those bends.

Brianmoooore wrote:The disadvantage of using dealer pipes is that you have to make the very tight bends near the tee piece in order for the other ends to reach where they should. Making your own, you can make them that tiny bit longer, and ease off on the radius of those bends.

I agree Brian. I for one advocate Kunifer, same as you.

The trouble is a roll of Kunifer isn't that cheap plus he would need to buy a flaring tool and the fittings etc. The steel can be bent around a 27mm socket which will give that rediculously tight bend into the tee piece without the pipe folding. Horses for courses I guess.

old_skool_2002 wrote:[The trouble is a roll of Kunifer isn't that cheap plus he would need to buy a flaring tool and the fittings etc. .

The last time I bought some it was about £8, IIRC, but that was before the massive copper price rise of last year. Might be in for a shock the next time I buy some!
Fittings were less than 10p each.
All from my local motor factors.

old_skool_2002

Just sent a PM.

Brianmoooore wrote:

old_skool_2002 wrote:[The trouble is a roll of Kunifer isn't that cheap plus he would need to buy a flaring tool and the fittings etc. .

The last time I bought some it was about £8, IIRC, but that was before the massive copper price rise of last year. Might be in for a shock the next time I buy some!
Fittings were less than 10p each.
All from my local motor factors.

I've seen kunifer on ebay for around a tenner for 25ft.

Fair play, that is cheap. Proper stuff too. 90/10 copper nickel.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/3-16-CUPRO-NICKEL ... dZViewItem

Brian, raid the piggy bank and buy some now!

I paid double that at a factors for a couple of rolls

Wiledw have replied to your PM.

old_skool_2002 wrote:Brian, raid the piggy bank and buy some now!

OK for it at the moment - found a couple of 'lost' rolls in a cupboard recently.
Hopefully copper prices will have come back to normal by the time I want some.
Copper water pipe is already well down from the peak price.

I have a roll of what appears to be copper welding wire - have no idea what it's intended for!

Copper coated steel MIG wire, I expect.

Thanks Brian, might give it a go then Is there any reason why they copper coated it?

To conduct the electricity to the welding tip.

Cool, thanks again Brian

Have the same problem on my cab and contemplated doing it at the weekend but without ramps and some decent tools to cut off the old joins etc I gave up and it is going to the garage to be sorted just hope it costs the £150 mentioned above!! Will let you know how I get on!