E30 Zone

I was looking on autotrader just last night...the prices for 325i sports is a joke. Some are looking very nice, but for £5000.00 poor fuel return. etc etc...i will try not to go on...170bhp-maybe 140mph 0-60 in 7.5

Then i thought well what else is out there for £5000.00

PORSCHE 944 TURBO

1.German build quality-doesnt get better than PORSCHE
2.Fantastic club following and support
3.Rarer than the E30 325i Sport-ive looked at the numbers
4.50-70 in 3.3seconds in 3rd Gear
5.250bhp Standard. a chip. a filter. exhaust = 285hp+
6.Adjustable ride hieght and damper settings as standard (yellow konis)
7.4 pot PORSCHE brakes. standard they (do make the best lets be honest)
8.160mph
9.16IN Lightweight alloys standard
10.near 50/50 weight distribution thanks to the gearbox being mounted at the rear and engine mounted right upto the bulkhead.
ALL FOR £4995.00-
There wasnt just 1 there were loads.
then there is the S2- 3ltr 16v 211bhp all the same as above-only 153mph-slighly slower overall, but also cheaper. then i looked at an E36 M3, and £5k buys you a battered one at best. still cant match these mini supercars. The 944 was faster than a the normaly asparated 911 of the day in 1990. Gosh...what have i been putting my money into...im moving to the darker side...SEE YOU ON THE AUTO BAHN......xx

No i'll see you at the bus stop when you loose your driving lisence

You dont buy E30's for their speed, you buy them cause they push the right buttons. If i wanted speed i would have bought a 3.2 M3 Evo, but i opted for a Motorsport instead and by the time i'm done pimping it, it will me enough to buy 2 x 3.2 Evo's, but where's the fun in that?

You can buy a R5 GT Turbo for a fraction of the £5k and it will piss all over any Porsche 944 or E30 Sport if you want just power without any add on's. I had one years ago and it was running 220bhp. I use to leave Ferrari's at the light's cause that car weighs so little it could probably be giving away in Cornflakes boxes

[quote="bootyman"]No i'll see you at the bus stop when you loose your driving lisence

You dont buy E30's for their speed, you buy them cause they push the right buttons. If i wanted speed i would have bought a 3.2 M3 Evo, but i opted for a Motorsport instead and by the time i'm done pimping it, it will me enough to buy 2 x 3.2 Evo's, but where's the fun in that?

Very true Bootyman, I could have bought a E36 M3 too, but the is for me as you said push's all the buttons

I always liked the 944, here in SA, the turbos keep there price, they go for about 10k-13k pounds, but the the normal NA944 go for about 5500 pounds. I dont think i will get a 944 to replace my e30 i would get it as a 2nd car to use once in awhile, because even thou u can pick up one fairly cheap, they are still a porsche in the end and cost a lot to maintain. Anyway thats my 2cents

944 - been there, seen it, done it, broken down in it many times!

Dont bother unless you are very friendly with a cheap mechanic... in my 6 months of 944 owenrship (a mint 80k example) - it needed new coil springs, head gasket, starter, headlamp motor, washer motor, etc etc... i could go on..

yeah they are fast and have 50:50 weight distrubution, but seriously dont bother!

Go on straight 6, buy a 944 turbo , and post a thread of the woes and dramas, it will probably rival Rob Mfree's in no time ! . Thankfully i have never owned a 944 but i have had 968s , 928s and 911s each one was an unreliable moneypit.

the 944 does on the surface look like a fair alternative to a 325 sport but parts are a lot more expensive and mechanics who know them rare and expensive. Also good sports are expensive because they are very rare probably less common now than decent porsches or even M3's.

werent porsche voted the most unreliable maufacturer by whatcar or something?

No car is cheap to maintain you dont get much change out of £200 for a service even when you do it yourself but the saloon I have hasn't cost me anything except servicing and a clutch cylinders in over 14,000 miles

Here is the whatcar reliability chart... porche avarage cost per repair

No wonder eBayers say service history with "thousands of pounds worth of receipts!"




I see bmw is lower down now, but the e30's were from a different era when people gave a sh*t about the quality of the cars

We will probably all see this chap at the Gay bar then!! lol
944 hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm noooooooo thanks e30 anyday but if i wanted all out power for the same money as a e30 the 944 would be below the lada riviera! lol but seriously id have a mitsubishi lancer evo 3 GSR! for about 3800. all day long running around 270 - 320 bhp and itd eat most things daily...................Oh And second to wat bootymans said the R5s are foookin mental i saw one pull 12secs up pod the other week! and me m8 had a BB tuning 200bhp One which would eat anything anywhere lol..

bootyman wrote: that car weighs so little it could probably be giving away in Cornflakes boxes

Yes, now imagine crashing in a cornflakes box

How about this though:

I bought my 325i for £275, spent about £4k on my turbo conversion and it now has 270bhp so that's less/bhp than the 944.

That said I have driven a 944 and it was stunning how well screwed together it was and how smooth the engine was considering it's a shitty 4-banger

Porsches are nice but just try running one.

If you ask nicely I might drop a few coppers in your plastic cup when I next see you.

If I had the cash then I'm afraid to say I woud definitely go for a 944, as long as it was either a turbo or s2 though, possibly the 2.7.
I think they're great cars, and even though I do love my e30 (most of the time) I think just looks alone is enough to sway me in the direction of a 944.

I am biased though coz I've been an avid porsche fan since I was about five and the 959 came out. Just need to work a few more years till I can afford to buy and maintain one.

Good luck which ever way you go.

Nick

Turbo-Brown wrote: a shitty 4-banger

now now
lets not knock 4 pots

my advise, which will be ignored no doubt is give the porker a big swerve

5K car with 45K car runing costs is not a wise move, they were £Â£Ã‚£Ã‚£ new, and the servicing cost still reflects the original value dude.

granted a good one will have you smiling for a few months, but it will go wrong and it wont be cheap

another vote for the e30, again , I drive one out of choice, not financial restrictions.

my mates 968 wouldn't start the other day.

to fix it cost slightly over a grand for a secondhand ecu

i was jealous of it up to that point, now i'm just blooody relieved it wasn't mine.

don't really like 944s anyway, too much like a 924, and only four cylinders, yuk

Offcourse I love the 944 Turbo! ( see signature ) But don't underestimate the S2. That engine is just great with a very big powerband.

Personally I think a 944 turbo is an awsome bit of kit, and a bargain these days
You have to remember though in its day it was one of the quickest point ot point cars out there, and so its essential to buy a good well serviced/looked after one, and be aware it will have high running costs.

The late 944 turbo s/se came with even bigger brakes and the M030 suspension pack

I'd much rather spend the money on one and run it as a low mileage weekend car than fork out the stupid price that 325i sports go for.

Anyway this vid sums up the 944 turbo for me
http://vanadium.prg.dtu.dk/~pmc/andersj ... TurboS.WMV

dobbie82 wrote:Here is the whatcar reliability chart... porche avarage cost per repair

No wonder eBayers say service history with "thousands of pounds worth of receipts!"




I see bmw is lower down now, but the e30's were from a different era when people gave a sh*t about the quality of the cars

To me that looks lke bullshit. The only reason Daewoo is number 8 is because people who own them never drive them further than the end of the street. The company I work for has 2 of them and they are constantly broken, I think the components are made of tin foil.

I think this site is more accurate:

http://www.reliabilityindex.co.uk/defau ... 9010848601

Oh and another point, the entire body of the 944 is galvanized, unlike the rust horrors hidden under those mtech kits...

Cool video - bit of an underwear emergency for the driver a minute from the end.

As for the 944 issue - My next car will prob be a 944 Turbo. OK the running costs will be higher but worth it imo. I'd rather spend £5k on a nice Turbo than an overpriced Sport any day of the week.


Taylor.

you will still have to live the with the embarrassment of driving a porsche tho.. cheap/quick or whatever

I think the embarassing image that used to haunt both BMW and Porsche in the 80's is long gone
I can see how someone could be embarassed driving one of the common as muck later BMWs or a Porsche Cayenne, but frankly I have far better things to worry about than what someone else thinks of the car I'm driving.

Taylor325i wrote:Cool video - bit of an underwear emergency for the driver a minute from the end.

As for the 944 issue - My next car will prob be a 944 Turbo. OK the running costs will be higher but worth it imo. I'd rather spend £5k on a nice Turbo than an overpriced Sport any day of the week.


Taylor.

Indeed - trouser change please!
But just shows what its capable of, 8m20 or so BTG time despite a couple of moments, pretty unsmooth sideways driving and iffy lines in the odd spot.

If I wanted a 325i sport, I'd just buy a cheap, good nick regular 325i, and fit an LSD (which I was what I did before I had the 318iS)
You have nearly the same car then for a fraction of the cost, and you can always fit the other sport bits at later date if you want them.
I think a realistic price for the sport would be a few hundred to a grand on top of a regular 325i. Problem is there are so many tatty/thrashed/rusty sports out there that the good ones can command a premium

944=poor mans porche, i wouldnt have one. they dont get any respect on the street, i would have an e30 anyday over one of those. the amount of looks i get are unbelivable(loads) it dosent matter that shes a 320i, shes a very good example of a 320i. u dont buy e30's for speed (unless your ant and turbo them!!!! oh how are the scoobys ant lol? still leaveing them for dust?) u buy an e30 for the drive and the smile factor, also the FACT that they are the BEST BMW EVER MADE! imho

'dont get any respect on the street'

WTF how sad are you? Who cares what others think

And if 944 = poor mans Porsche then what the hell do you think an E30 says in BMW terms?

'u buy an e30 for the drive and the smile factor'

Yep, but you need to remember the 944 will do exactly the same, it was the basis for the 968cs, which along with the e30 m3 is considered one of the best drivers cars ever.

Dont throw stones when you're in a glass 320i house

Lordschleife wrote:Dont throw stones when you're in a glass 320i house

Anyone who thinks of a 944 in the same way as a 924 obviously has sh!t for brains.

The early 944 turbos are 220bhp.
The later post-88 ones have 250bhp - may be badged 'turbo S' on early cars.

I'll have to disagree with a lot of the piffle that people are stating here as fact.
The 944 was NEVER a 'poor man's Porsche'. The 924 would have been the 'cheap' Porsche (last sold into '89 I believe), but, it was never a cheap car. Porsche had a history of selling lower performance cars to go along with the 911 - the 912, the 914 and the 912E before the 924).
The 944 isn't just a rehashed 924 - it may have shared the same basic bodyshell and (in early models) the interior, it has a real race derived engine, and chassis from Le Mans, and is a serious performance car, especially in the turbo model. The turbo was as fast as the contemporary 911, and had much better handling, having near 50/50 weight balance.
Unreliable? I had a 'Silver Rose' 944 turbo, (which was the first of the 250bhp models) from new. I had the car for 4 years, and sold it on to a friend of mine who still has the car. Neither of us have had any major issues with the car, aside from normal servicing and wear and tear. The worst thing to go wrong was the fuel pump dying recently. I still drive the car every now and again, and it still looks and feels as good as it did in my ownership, after 150k miles.
I know several other people who drive 924S' (the one with the 944 engine), 944's, turbo's and 968's and only a few have had serious issues, and all with cars that had unknown history and looked to have been abused. They were bought purely for being cheap for track days and racing. Parts aren't as expensive as people are making out, and are readily available.
A modded E30, no matter how good will never handle anything like a 944 (and remember, the very little changed 968 was 'Performance Car of the Year' for several years). As regards getting respect on the street, anyone that knows anything about cars will have respect for a 944 turbo. I've seen plenty of boy racers willing to take on an E30, yet instantly back off when I came into the equation. So much so that when I was stopped doing 127mph in a 60 (safely enough), the officer seemed to be more interested as to whether it was a real turbo or not than booking me. Which is respect enough.
An E30 is (to be honest), a poor man's BMW these days in most people's eyes, and, are a lot more common than 944s let alone turbos.

A 944S2 offers pretty much all the performance of the turbo, but, just doesn't have the same shove in the back as the turbo, so, it doesn't feel as quick.
If you're going for an 8v 2.5 car, the later, faster, and possibly cheaper 924S is probably a better buy. The 2.7 should be avoided (as it was only made for 1 year, so, certain parts are hard to come by, although a lot of the engine parts are shared with the later 928S4...

We ran a 8v944 for 40k miles, 1 failed gasket, 1 engine mount and a leaking fuel tank. Total repairs, approx 650 pounds over 6 years. Servicing wasn't bad, handling and braking are far superior to any E30 I've driven and it was beautifully built. They can cost an arm and a leg to repair to be fair, but it generally takes years of neglect to get to that stage.

Our Sport has cost at least 1000 pounds in just over 18 months.

Get a 2.5 Touring and fit an LSD. Sorted!
(and no stupid plastic bits whose only purpose is to fall off and reveal years of rust).

i'll probably get shot for this, but for 5k id buy an e36 328i sport coupe.

Lordschleife wrote:'dont get any respect on the street'

WTF how sad are you? Who cares what others think

And if 944 = poor mans Porsche then what the hell do you think an E30 says in BMW terms?

'u buy an e30 for the drive and the smile factor'

Yep, but you need to remember the 944 will do exactly the same, it was the basis for the 968cs, which along with the e30 m3 is considered one of the best drivers cars ever.

Dont throw stones when you're in a glass 320i house

throw stones cos im in a 320i house? uv got a 318is? dont make me laugh. you shouldnt be throwing any stones! i only have the 320 because i choose to have it, i could go out tomorrow and get a 318is or a 325i or even (god forbid) an e36m3! if i was going to get a 325i it would be the m50. dont give me that crap. and i dgaf what other people think, they are classic cars now and need to be appreciated be it 316,318,320,323,325.

e30bmlover wrote:

Lordschleife wrote:'dont get any respect on the street'

WTF how sad are you? Who cares what others think

And if 944 = poor mans Porsche then what the hell do you think an E30 says in BMW terms?

'u buy an e30 for the drive and the smile factor'

Yep, but you need to remember the 944 will do exactly the same, it was the basis for the 968cs, which along with the e30 m3 is considered one of the best drivers cars ever.

Dont throw stones when you're in a glass 320i house

throw stones cos im in a 320i house? uv got a 318is? dont make me laugh. you shouldnt be throwing any stones! i only have the 320 because i choose to have it, i could go out tomorrow and get a 318is or a 325i or even (god forbid) an e36m3! if i was going to get a 325i it would be the m50. dont give me that crap. and i dgaf what other people think, they are classic cars now and need to be appreciated be it 316,318,320,323,325.

I'm curious have you actually ever driven a 318is? You seam to dislike them a lot...


I had a look at a couple of 944/924 at the "cheap" end of the price braket. Saw a dark blue 944 for £600 was nice had service history and NO rust. I wish i bought it but I made the mistake of "walking away to think about it" in which time it sold... The rest I saw were not as nice. Standard 944 was going to be cheaper to insure than a 325i for me for some reason...

Parts are a little more expensive, but not that much.