E30 Zone

Im going to collect a e30 later today was going to use a Aframe as i dont have anyone to drive it back with me anyway the car has no mot or tax am i able to tow it back on the motorway?

a towed car MUST have tax at least mate... legally, you are not allowed to tow it at all. car trailer is the best option... sorry.

Yes, as long you have your flashers on and on the back window of car being towed write in tow and you will be ok

The car is being tow'ed so the car doing the towing must be taxed and mot'd.

Check on the dvla site for validation of my comment.

If you can get a dolly (front wheels lifted) rather than an A frame you will be Ok. There is a technical argument that its illegal as its half trailer/half towing, but nobody has ever been prosecuted for it so its only a theoretical argument. RVs/motorhomes also use A frames regularly, and again none have ever been prosecuted. It is a risk, but the biggest risk is of getting caught up in an accident when anything/everything will be investigated as insurance companies try and minimise their losses. Proper trailer is by far the best option, and pretty cheap to hire out for the day.

It's only when the car being towed is maned that it becomes ilegal to tow more that 1 junction. (rope or straight bar)

my iS had spent the last few years untaxed and un mot-ed and has been transported from place to place using a dolly, its fine to do so, like zaust says just be sure people behind the towee know ( though it would be hard not to know lol!)

i personally wouldnt risk it, i would use a car trailer safer and legal.

It also depends on when you passed your test as to the limits you can tow.

i can answer this with 100 % accuracy. if the towed vehicle has to have a driver sitting in it for steering or braking or any operations the towed vehicle must be moted, taxed and insured and thats it 100 % fact. i know this cause i got pulled towing a renault 5 6 miles down the road and i got banned for 2 months for doing it ! and the driver sitting in towed vehicle got 9 points. and we both got hefty fines.

i use a dolly now, i dont trust them a frames ive seen what can happen with them there shit !

not a big fan of the a frame one man tow idea. I've only ever used one once and it was moving the 325 I'm breaking the now. we were using my mates landcruiser to do the towing and we felt the land cruiser getting shoved about a bit on roundabouts and tight bends and the landcruiser is a big heavy beast so i wouldn't like to see what would have happened if we had been using a normal car to do the towing... I've also seen a few cars get written off when towing other cars using the one man tows . my mates orion ended out on its roof while he was towing a Subaru ( i did tell him not to do it as the other car was heavier than his!!!) my brothers sierra went straight on into a field while towing an escort.. and another bloke i know wiped his transit out with a pug 405 on tow . so in my eyes id never use one id rather use the trailer or get one of my mates with a recovery wagon

The only reason i bought one was cause ive seen the AA use them flat out! on motorways dual carriageways etc....

I know if you use a towbar or rope both the cars have to be legal ie have mot,tax insurance and both the drivers must have a full uk licence but using a Aframe the car being towed is like a trailer?.........

My mate does some car collections and he can put 2 cars on his truck but ive seen him put 2 cars on the truck and one on the tow bar with a Aframe.....

I dont know what to do now cause i wanted to go and collect the car for about 5pm

If any or all wheels are on the road it must be taxed,mot'd and insured.

Can anybody post the links for any legal background to this? All I've found with a quick google search were a few debates stating "facts" but nothing to say where the info came from so probably mostly myth. I used a dolly for my race car for 1 1/2 seasons, overtaken by motorway police regularly with no funny looks or indications that anything was amis. I use a trailer now, but would be interested to know what the legal basis of it all is. My post above was based on something I read on a motorhome club site, it did give the legal background but that long ago now I've forgotten it.

I personally wouldn't use an A frame on the motorway the one I used had a speed restriction 40mph I seem to remember
be better to get yourself a car trailer much safer

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/CAR-RECOVERY-A-FR ... 240%3A1318

This guy has clearly put on his ad that the Aframe can be used on the motorway and can be used to tow cars that have no mot or tax and insurance...... maybe he just put that to get a sale or he might have done some research into this........

If you were to use a dolly or a frame that was not braked then it would come under the road traffic act.

Construction and use of vehicles

40A Using vehicle in dangerous condition etc A person is guilty of an offence if he uses, or causes or permits another to use, a motor vehicle or trailer on a road when””
(a) the condition of the motor vehicle or trailer, or of its accessories or equipment, or
(b) the purpose for which it is used, or
(c) the number of passengers carried by it, or the manner in which they are carried, or
(d) the weight, position or distribution of its load, or the manner in which it is secured,
is such that the use of the motor vehicle or trailer involves a danger of injury to any person.”a
(2) For section 42 of that Act there shall be substituted””
”a41A Breach of requirement as to brakes, steering-gear or tyres A person who””
(a) contravenes or fails to comply with a construction and use requirement as to brakes, steering-gear or tyres, or
(b) uses on a road a motor vehicle or trailer which does not comply with such a requirement, or causes or permits a motor vehicle or trailer to be so used,
is guilty of an offence

Basically if you are towing anything over 750kg it has to braked.So if the dolly or a frame did not have brakes or operate the cars brakes it would not comply with the rta under construction and use.At least thats how i understand it.

Loony wrote:Basically if you are towing anything over 750kg it has to braked.So if the dolly or a frame did not have brakes or operate the cars brakes it would not comply with the rta under construction and use.At least thats how i understand it.

Correctamundo.

Most A frames are illegal in that they have no way of operating the towed vehicle's brakes. Anything you tow with a gross weight of over 750 kg must have independent brakes. Most A frames don't. I have seen some with Heath Robinson type braking cables, but I've no idea how effective they are.

336tdse wrote:i can answer this with 100 % accuracy. if the towed vehicle has to have a driver sitting in it for steering or braking or any operations the towed vehicle must be moted, taxed and insured and thats it 100 % fact. i know this cause i got pulled towing a renault 5 6 miles down the road and i got banned for 2 months for doing it ! and the driver sitting in towed vehicle got 9 points. and we both got hefty fines.

i use a dolly now, i dont trust them a frames ive seen what can happen with them there shit !

What were you towing with? Solid bar? Rope? Etc

Jesus325iTouring wrote:

336tdse wrote:i can answer this with 100 % accuracy. if the towed vehicle has to have a driver sitting in it for steering or braking or any operations the towed vehicle must be moted, taxed and insured and thats it 100 % fact. i know this cause i got pulled towing a renault 5 6 miles down the road and i got banned for 2 months for doing it ! and the driver sitting in towed vehicle got 9 points. and we both got hefty fines.

i use a dolly now, i dont trust them a frames ive seen what can happen with them there shit !

What were you towing with? Solid bar? Rope? Etc

solid bar.

zaust wrote:Yes, as long you have your flashers on and on the back window of car being towed write in tow and you will be ok

The car is being tow'ed so the car doing the towing must be taxed and mot'd.

Check on the dvla site for validation of my comment.

rac state if any wheels are on the floor then the towed vehicle must have tax

im not sure if this is just their policy or a leagl requirement

ive towed cars that have had no ticket or tax on a dolly and not had any problems with the law

personaly i cant see there being a problem just make sure your insurance covers you to tow.

only my van insurance covers towing the car policy doesnt

336tdse wrote:

Jesus325iTouring wrote:

336tdse wrote:i can answer this with 100 % accuracy. if the towed vehicle has to have a driver sitting in it for steering or braking or any operations the towed vehicle must be moted, taxed and insured and thats it 100 % fact. i know this cause i got pulled towing a renault 5 6 miles down the road and i got banned for 2 months for doing it ! and the driver sitting in towed vehicle got 9 points. and we both got hefty fines.

i use a dolly now, i dont trust them a frames ive seen what can happen with them there shit !

What were you towing with? Solid bar? Rope? Etc

solid bar.

I was just curious really about the full facts behind this,you and your pal got some serious flak,and i've towed many things over the years on a solid bar with no grief from the Feds.
Was the 5 being towed a total wreck,ie bald tyres busted lights etc,or just simply out of T&T?

I've towed countless turds with my A frame and never had any bother from the law.

CG_Maintenance wrote:

zaust wrote:Yes, as long you have your flashers on and on the back window of car being towed write in tow and you will be ok

The car is being tow'ed so the car doing the towing must be taxed and mot'd.

Check on the dvla site for validation of my comment.

rac state if any wheels are on the floor then the towed vehicle must have tax

im not sure if this is just their policy or a leagl requirement

ive towed cars that have had no ticket or tax on a dolly and not had any problems with the law

personaly i cant see there being a problem just make sure your insurance covers you to tow.

only my van insurance covers towing the car policy doesnt

Towing on a dolly is different as dolly's are usually braked therfore the car becomes a braked trailer, on an a frame it is effectivley an unbraked trailer so the max weight of 750kg applies.

I've towed loads of cars using an A frame and it's pretty sound. You have to be careful tho especially round roundabouts which must be taken particularly slowly. It's easiest on the motorway if you stick to around 50 or 60 and leave a good distance from the car infront.

My old 1986 325i towed a rover 400 diesel from Kent to Merseyside using an A frame! Whether it's entirely legal or not I don't know but I was overtaken by a number of coppers who seemed 'interested' but never actually pulled me over.

I have towed cars on a trailer too but if the towing car is any smaller than a land rover or range rover I'd prefer to tow using an A frame because it makes the whole rig just a bit lighter.

tomson wrote:I've towed countless turds with my A frame and never had any bother from the law.

Did any of them have t&t?

I've towed many of scrappers on ropes and straight bars and never had any trouble with the law. the one that springs to mind was towing an ldv minibus that had been laid up in a mates drive under a tree for 6 years i towed it with my old mondeo td was using a rope and taking it straight to the weigh bridge. we hadnt even gotten out of the town with it and the coppers drove by us. they slowed down looked at the mondeo ( which was all legal but didn't have a straight panel to its name and a cracked windscreen ) looked at the ldv shook there heads and kept on going to be honest i reckon they just didn't want the paper work

It sounds to me as tho' you've got to decide whether to risk it OR NOT!!! With trailers being readily available (even on ebay) and quite cheap to rent, I don't think I'd risk it. Knowing my luck I'd be the one to get stopped. Also, look at the worst possible outcome, you have something go wrong and someone gets seriously hurt or killed (O.K. not likely but very possible) and your seen to be cause.

e30-unit-soldier wrote:

tomson wrote:I've towed countless turds with my A frame and never had any bother from the law.

Did any of them have t&t?

Nope, none - if they had I would have driven them!

I have recovered a car from Dover to Bristol with my A frame and a friend borrowed it and he picked one up in Manchester and towed it back to Bristol.

jbh wrote:I've towed many of scrappers on ropes and straight bars and never had any trouble with the law. the one that springs to mind was towing an ldv minibus that had been laid up in a mates drive under a tree for 6 years i towed it with my old mondeo td was using a rope and taking it straight to the weigh bridge. we hadnt even gotten out of the town with it and the coppers drove by us. they slowed down looked at the mondeo ( which was all legal but didn't have a straight panel to its name and a cracked windscreen ) looked at the ldv shook there heads and kept on going to be honest i reckon they just didn't want the paper work

probably normal plod

you can bet your life trafic would have had a different view
or is that just the welsh forces

jbh wrote:I've towed many of scrappers on ropes and straight bars and never had any trouble with the law. the one that springs to mind was towing an ldv minibus that had been laid up in a mates drive under a tree for 6 years i towed it with my old mondeo td was using a rope and taking it straight to the weigh bridge. we hadnt even gotten out of the town with it and the coppers drove by us. they slowed down looked at the mondeo ( which was all legal but didn't have a straight panel to its name and a cracked windscreen ) looked at the ldv shook there heads and kept on going to be honest i reckon they just didn't want the paper work

More likely they were worried that you were en route to a pikey camp and they'd never get a summons served anyway ;)

i think it's the 750kg thing that's the biggest problem.

a driverless car being towed on a solid A-frame, with a rear trailerboard displaying the tow cars registration and lights is nothing more than a metal 4 wheel trailer carrying an engine.

as long as the engine is not connected (it's in neutral) there is noone in it, the tyres have legal tread, and it's not in dangerous condition then i'm fairly sure you would be 'safe' as it's technically being used as a trailer, not a car being towed, and trailers don't need tax or mots.

the weight limit is the problem, as any trailer over 750kg needs to be braked, and there are very few cars + a-frame that would be less than this.

also check your license, i passed in 1997, and can only tow a car + trailer with a total weight of 3500kg.

you are right, a lot of motorhomes tow a car on an a-frame, but from what i have seen, they are almost exclusively little fiat cinquecentos, which should sneak under the 750kg thing, and there are less likely to be weight based towing issues when towing a little town car behind a few tons worth of motorhome than towing an e30 behind an e30.

whether plod will know the ins and outs, and whether you decide it's worth the risk is up to you.

e30-unit-soldier wrote:The only reason i bought one was cause ive seen the AA use them flat out! on motorways dual carriageways etc....

I know if you use a towbar or rope both the cars have to be legal ie have mot,tax insurance and both the drivers must have a full uk licence but using a Aframe the car being towed is like a trailer?.........

My mate does some car collections and he can put 2 cars on his truck but ive seen him put 2 cars on the truck and one on the tow bar with a Aframe.....

I dont know what to do now cause i wanted to go and collect the car for about 5pm

they use dollys mate, never seen a aa van with a a frame