Thinking of a E30, which should i get?

[TheTyrant]

HI Guys,
My first post on here ( be gentle ) as im usually over on the MLR site as i currently drive a Mitsu Evo2 ( money pit!), and am now also looking for a E30 bmw to use as a fun daily driver, which i can also use for commuting, longer journeys ( Evo only does 15-20mpg, even on a run!) and i also want to do a few trackdays to have some rear steering fun, Evo is good on the track but has far too much grip in the dry and costs a fortune at 8mpg!.

Ideally i would like a 325i sport... but due to Evo slurping the money i havent got that sort of a budget for the Bm...so ive narrowed it down to 2 main choices from what ive read on here and other sites....

318is nice and Light, good starting package and reasonably cheap ( does it have enough power though?)

325i - More grunt than above ( is it that much) but more money for a good 2 door.

I would be interested to hear all your views and opinions on the 2 models above, and would be good do get a drive in both variants to feel the differences etc....anyone near me in Cumbria? . I also wouldnt mind buying and then swapping in a bigger engine like the M50 2.5 for that little bit more grunt, so is the 325 a better option for this ?.....ultimatley i would like a nice clean original 2 door E30 fitted with later E36 M3 motor and 6speed box for the ultimate street sleeper!.

CHeers
Ian

[tomstickland]

I'm biassed and I'd say 318is. There's good reason for this though.

First lets talk about the power. The on paper acceleration times for the 318is look worrying, but in reality I've found that it exactly matches an 8v Mk2 Golf GTi and so has a friend of mine. Both were straight line acceleration runs from 20-90ish. Most people look back through their rose tinted spectactles at what a great car the MK2 Golf GTi was.
So what I'm saying is, not amazingly fast in acceleration terms, but not annoyingly slow.

Now to the clever bit....the engine is not the most important part about the car. It's the way that the chassis and set up allow the engine to be used to 100% of its ability. The throttle adjustability and the solid feel all allow you to maintain momentum at all costs. This is what makes the car such fun to drive. It'll make you search out obscure B roads for the corners.

I went from about 190BHP/tonne down to an iS, I've driven one for 3-4 months now and I'm in no way bored or frustrated with it. In fact, it's the opposite, all I can see is a learning curve stretching far into the future.

If you must have more power then a 325 is a good idea since sports are expensive. They don't have the MTech suspension or LSD, but the engine is identical. I've driven a 325 once and the acceleration was good - on a par with the 150BHP FWD hot hatches of the late 80s. Heavier engine of course and mpg in the low-mid 20s.

Actually, from what you're saying you should try a 325 then look into fitting a spring/damper kit and then sourcing an LSD.

[astondg]

Welcome!

My father has an Evo VI, when we go to the track he gets about 20mpg average for the whole journey (about 70km to track and 70km back and then about 25 laps). At the moment my 323i is averaging about 12mpg regardless of whether I go to the track or drive around on the road , so the Evo is actually better!

If you want rear steer fun you should go for the 325i. My slightly modified 323i with 4.1 LSD and good tyres cannot break traction on a dry track and it's handling and balance is actually very similar to the Evo. I'm sure it could be drifted through the higher speed corners but it would take some creative wheel and pedal work and would be too hard on the car I think. I have driven the Evo and it has a slightly more grip at turn in but I think similar mid corner speed. My father followed me through a couple of corners and said the same thing. Grip on corner exit would go to the Evo except that it's full throttle in both cars from the same point on most corners because I don't have enough power to worry the grip. On both dirt and bitumen the Evo VI and E30 seems to have very similar basic handling characteristics, it's just that the Evo has more grip (for both lateral and longitudinal acceleration) and more power.

Acceleration in my 323i is poor, tomstickland just said that a 318is is ok but if it is anything like my 323i then I'm not so sure. I'd like a twin cam engine though and the 318is should be even better balanced. I have had my 323i for about 2 years now and I am really looking for something more, probably power because the handling and grip is there. I think I am getting about as much as I can from it. That's as much as I can, another driver might get more but an advanced driver trainer I had with me 6 months ago said there didn't seem to be much more. That's on the bitumen too, on the dirt I still have room for improvement.

Anyway I think an E30 would be a good RWD car to have with an Evo.

EDIT: Also I don't know if you have done this yet but you have to take your Evo racing on the dirt. Guaranteed to make you smile .

Aston

[TOURINGDADDY]

if ur lookin for practil fun then get a tourin. and there the best for driftin too

[TheTyrant]

HI,
Ok thanks for the input so far. pretty much as i thought...the 318is does appeal to me for various reasons...... seem cheaper for a good one compared to a good 325i.....nice revvy 16v engine, better economy etc....but ideally i need the 325 for the grunt on track, have looked at the tourings as well as generally far better looked after due to there design ( not many chavs hammering them to death compared to saloons).

More info/opinions though if anyone has them

Cheers
Ian

p.s - Astondg : If you get that mpg out of an Evo then you need to turn up the boost! ...im running 1.5bar and near 400hp which requires plenty of fuel

[tomstickland]

Yes 325 sounds more like what you want to me. The 318iS is never going to satisfy an acceleration freak. However, I've found that they do have enough power to make going round corners in 3rd gear fun. Not enough to make the wheels spin, but enough to make you aware that the back is doing something.

[dobbie82]

i have a cheap 318i up for sale.... in grasmere.. and i can deliver!

decent power for very little petrol. has an iS front lip and a rear spoiler on it... so you can pretend,....

dont worry i know im weird

[Zayyan]

I think the 325i is definitely better for what you're looking for.

318is simply won't be quick enough.

[Chaos]

go for the 6 pot m8 u wont regret it.

silky smooth, lovely note to it when u press on, and if ur careful with the right boot u can see 30mpg odd on a run.

[TheTyrant]

Ok so its seem that in the long term i really need the 6pot motor.....next thing.....say i was to buy a nice clean sensibly priced 318 (dobbie82 PM me a price and details) and then once more funds build i was to transplant a 6 pot into it...say for starters a M50 2.5 which i can get fairly cheap..... is this going to be a lot more work than doing the swap on a 325i ?....or am i better off just waiting till the right 325 in good nick and sensibly priced comes along ? ( which seem to be few and far between)

The other concern i had was that the 325's tend to of seen a harder life due to people wanting the same things im looking for....and as these cars are now getting on a bit, will a 100k+ motor be upto track use ?. I have just rebuilt my evo motor over this last winter, so dont mind if it needs doing, just wondering if i need to be looking at doing it pretty much straight away if im going on the track....or are they pretty strong if serviced well etc ?



Cheers
Ian

[dobbie82]

pm sent

[E30cool]

Welcome to the zone mate, think I would go for the 325, much tail happy fun.

[johnono]

get the best one u can mate , they are old"er" cars so integrety of the shell is as important if not more so than the engine ( do a swap if it goes tits up )

i.s or a 6 potter will get u the best base, but if u have the dollards get a minted m3 , i think if we had the dollards weԚ´ed all have a minted m3

[Dominitry]

Deffo get a 325i!

[kirils]

From what IÔš'm reading it sounds like you donÔš't know what you want, if you donÔš't want to spend money buy the 318is and do not upgrade for new engine, itÔš's strong enough, and you can put a turbo in it and instead of the 4.10 put a 3.45 diff and the car will go 270km/h =167mph, without any problem, itÔš's a really good car, but if you want to put a stronger engine than buy 325i cause it already has bigger brakes abs and stuff like thatԚ… ( but if you ask me IÔš'd go for the 318is with turbo, itÔš's unbelievable fun when you are passing some new E55 which is limited on 250 kmh.. )

The pic is from 318is itÔš's going 245 and look at the revs, it still have lots to go

Regards Kiril ( friend from Macedonia)

[billgatese30]

if you were to get a 318 (or whatever) shell and then drop a better motor in later, then i think you would be better off putting in the 3.5 m30 engine (what came in the 535i/735i)

at about Ԛ£250 a pop for the engine itself then its not bad going and has bag loads of tourque for on the track, plus if it breaks/blows on the track then it isn't much to replace, high end pulling power is amazing compared to the m20 2.5 unit(what is in e30 325's)

PM either Toby_Unna or Andy335touring for more info on this swap azs they have bnoth done it, it would be perfect for track condtions, but i am unsuer about the MPG though, you would have to check that out with one of the lads above.

hope that helps





oh and welcome to the Zone

[TheTyrant]

OK so it seems a 325i is best bet to "run as is" and a 318is for same.. then either turbo or replace the motor with 6pot...better brakes and suspension on 318is gota be a major plus point over normal 318 etc ?

Still searching

Cheers
Ian

[billgatese30]

yes

the 318 is a 2 valve per cylinder, the 318is is 4 valve per cylinder, it has better tourque and power i htink it aboiut 110BHP to 136BHP, although i could be wrong about the figures for the 318i

the IS it is much tourqier, and has a much wider powerband

they also come with mtech suspension as standard and most came with LSD's.

there also rarer, and have things like sport seats and things like that as standard.

[Artis]

ide rather get a e21 323i

[Richy325iTouring]

ide rather get a e21 323i

no one asked you

the fella is asking what e30 to get

id say touring
325 proper drift tool and convienent for the diy jobs at the weekend around the house

[Artis]

ide rather get a e21 323i

no one asked you

the fella is asking what e30 to get

id say touring
325 proper drift tool and convienent for the diy jobs at the weekend around the house

just my choice e30 s are all looking the same these days

[Richy325iTouring]

ide rather get a e21 323i

no one asked you

the fella is asking what e30 to get

id say touring
325 proper drift tool and convienent for the diy jobs at the weekend around the house

just my choice e30 s are all looking the same these days

the questionwas about e30s and this is an e30 forum

well was last time i looked

[Artis]

so, a bmw is a bmw

[e30bmlover]

hi, im going for the undercover italian m3 the 320is, ok its a left hooker, and slightly underpowered compared to the 2.3ltr m3(hardly anything in it) but its the element of surprise that i love, u could badge it as a 320i or just put the ///m badge on the back, the reason it isnt badged as a m3 is because of the high taxes in italy for cars over 2.0ltr so bmw had to compromise. they shortened the displacement to 1990cc but dont be fooled it has got 192 hp @6,900 rpm and 155 lb/ft of torque @4,900 rpm... sooooooo it will hand most bmw's there ass. well there's my bit!

[Richy325iTouring]

320is rule

[e30bmlover]

that s14 engine sure packs a punch! they come from ital so they are virtually spotless, and the tought of haveing BMW M POWER on the lump gives me that funny feeling

[Dan318-is]

s14 is my god

good luck finding one tho fella

[e30bmlover]

i know someone who has 3 in the country. they start at 3 grand and go up to 5 grand. pm me if u want more details.

[astondg]

p.s - Astondg : If you get that mpg out of an Evo then you need to turn up the boost! ...im running 1.5bar and near 400hp which requires plenty of fuel

it's standard at the moment. The first thing we have to do is stop my 323i from being so thirsty, with the petrol prices right now we don't need another one .

The other concern i had was that the 325's tend to of seen a harder life due to people wanting the same things im looking for....and as these cars are now getting on a bit, will a 100k+ motor be upto track use ?. I have just rebuilt my evo motor over this last winter, so dont mind if it needs doing, just wondering if i need to be looking at doing it pretty much straight away if im going on the track....or are they pretty strong if serviced well etc ?

My 323i had about 150,000 miles when I got it and since then I have done about 2 years of driving and racing with about 20+ events a year. It's up to 160,000 miles and it still seems to be running ok. It looses just a little bit of oil over time but I think that might be leaking out from an old gasket or something rather than being used. I also think it might have had a bit of a hard life before I got it.

Aston

[TheTyrant]

Hmmm im thinking tourer might yet be an option, plenty of room for track wheels and fuels etc as well as carting evo engine bits around!, and generally better looked after and not thrashed as hard ( apart from you crazys on here ). See, better priced as well. Does the extra weight not slow them down much ?

Cheers
Ian

[astondg]

The tourers have better weight distribution (50/50 or close I think) and more weight at the back should mean extra traction but I'm not sure about the effects of the extra weight on the performance and handling limits. It might negate the benefit of the better distribution. There are a few here so hopefully they can help out.

Aston

[TheTyrant]

OK ive found what looks like a good buy 325i...but....as with all things like this there is a catch, central locking problem and fuses blowing!....are these common problems with a relativley easy fix ?....details from seller below ..

The problems.
The central locking has stopped working leaving 2 doors locked with the dead locks on (can't open them) 1 door unlocked that we can't lock and the drivers door lock not working properly.
The electric windows & sunroof will occasionally blow a fuse, I guess the mechanism probably just needs looking at

Any ideas people ? as apart from the above it looks like a good car with genuine 85k with fsh and no rust!

Cheers
Ian

[E30BeemerLad]

I know of an H reg 325se 2 dr in red that is going up for sale, car is in York, had a very brief look at it and it looked a tidy unmolested example, paintwork still good, bit of bubbling just starting to the rear arches but otherwise it looked a very tidy thing, on 14" BBS cross spokes.Think it has only done about 85K. Manual box, on board computer etc.

Let me know if you want more details as I can get hold of the fella. Think he has only owned it 3 months or so and is complaining about the fuel costs compared to his bike!

I believe he wants something in the order of Ԛ£1200 for the car.

[TheTyrant]

E30BeemerLad : Sounds interesting....little over my budget which is 1k max really...but if you can get me more info that would be good...you never know

Cheers
Ian

[Simon13]

Just read your thread and here are my thoughts.....

theres nothing in it between a touring and saloon, only touring i've played with though had a sport close ratio gearbox and sport lsd. touring is only 50kgs heavier than a saloon?

3.5 conversions are great and pretty cheap, real awsome shove down low and the extra litre really really shows at 70 mph plus compared to a 2.5. But they are in the same league nearly as your evo for petrol so not good there

I have had a 318iS and have a sport now, they are both great.
318iS is a real corner hero and the best handling E30 this side of an M3
but a 325 can be made into a fine handling car with a few mods, strut brace, thicker anti roll bars and a good shock spring combo. this would make a 318is even better too!

318iS has exactly same running gear to a 325 sport. but one thing with putting a 6 cyl lump into a car which was originally a 4 pot. There are loads of slight differences between them which can be annoying and confusing at times ask Jimbob!

lastly! i've driven an e30 with a 2.5 24v in it, not alot better than an M20 2.5 in an e30 really. 24v better top end as u expect but not alot, but the 12v lump has a bit more grunt down low.

If u want a 24v lump then go for a good M52 2.8 (E36 328i and E39 528i) without the nikasil bore problem and u will murder a 2.5 and keep with the 3.5 boys. plus the 2.8 has bolt on power which is cheap and will add a good 15-20bhp so a good hike from the 192 they are blessed with. Plus the 2.8 engine has great torque too. And ultimately will be better on fuel than all the engines mentioned probably. 318is might better it!

HTH